thailand_women_047Note: This was written in 2010 after my first week or two in Thailand. Since then. I’ve spent far more time in the country and have become more knowledgeable about the dynamics of the women, the bar girls, the sex tourism, etc. I’m aware most of the women hitting on me in this article are likely working girls or husband hunters. Regardless, that doesn’t change the point of the piece. Enjoy.

Gorgeous women seem to have life easy, don’t they? They seem to always get what they want, get as much attention as they want, and everything seems like it’s handed to them. They NEVER have to worry about finding a guy to date or having to pick one up. Everything takes care of itself, right?

Well, it may not be that simple.

I’m rounding out living a whole month in Thailand, and my experience with women here has been… well, different to say the least.

In case you didn’t know, Thailand may be the EASIEST place on the planet to get laid… especially if you’re white. There are a few reasons for this. First of all, about 80% of the young women here are either prostitutes, gold-diggers, obsessed/in-love with Western culture or some bizarre combination of all three.

(Perspective check. Before you get all turned off by the gold-digger thing, remember that buying a girl lunch here usually costs no more than $2, and that she grew up in a house with no electricity or running water with six starving siblings and an abusive father. OK, done.)

The women here love white men. The Thai men are naturally short, small, quiet and brutish. By comparison, the tall Westerners with their big statures, chiseled chins, and fat wallets are their version of Victoria’s Secret models.

Let’s put it this way — and this is NOT an exaggeration — if you’re white, taller than 5’6″, and younger than 40, you’re basically like a supermodel walking around and can go home with just about any girl you see. ANY GIRL. And if you’re Latin or Indian or Black, shorter or overweight, the effect is still the same, just to a lesser degree.

Just to give you an idea… I’ve spent the last 30 days living in a quiet beach town on Phuket Island. I’m about 30 minutes away from all of the partying and prostitutes of Patong and 45 minutes away from the main city on the island. I am by no means in a crazy party zone. In fact, I only went out four times my whole time here. But I get approached 3-5 times a day — not at bars or clubs — but just going about my day. Waitresses regularly sit down at my table to talk to me. I get cat calls from across the street daily. I’ve had two marriage proposals, and probably 3-4 flat propositions for sex each week… and that’s not even counting the prostitutes when I go into Patong.

Put bluntly, here *I* am the Perfect 10.

And what’s amazing is how all of this attention, all of these offers, and all of the constant harassment — and yes, it does become harassment after a while — completely changes your mindset. After a week, it had gotten old. By two weeks, my attitude had noticeably changed. After a month, I feel like I’m in the Twilight Zone. Even the most basic dating advice and pick up material seems absolutely anathema to me right now.

I’ve become that gorgeous woman — wait a second, that didn’t sound right (cue Lady Boy joke) — I’ve become that person who can use their attractiveness and status to get all of the attention and favors they want. I’m on the opposite side of the glass, staring back at the other side. Here’s what it looks like… and how we can learn from it…

The End of Sex As We Know It

The first and immediate shift in mentality was that revolving around sex. The first week I was here, I slept with two girls the only two nights I went out. Each night, I probably could have slept with 4-5 different girls, but I eventually settled on one (oh, darn). If I had wanted to, I probably could have fucked a new girl each day of the week (I’ve met a couple of Aussie guys who have done that).

But sex very quickly stopped becoming a priority. You know that saying, “You always want what you can’t have?” Well, it’s so ridiculously true in this situation. I think in the west, our obsession with sex stems from the fact that it’s withheld from us so fervently, and is still taboo within our culture.

Here, it’s as casual as walking the dog. And that quickly saps the joy and fun out of it. What is usually this exciting pursuit and adventure where we’re ultimately rewarded with this blissful and pleasurable experience with someone… here, it’s about as adventurous and exciting as deciding which steak on the menu you’d like to try tonight. Now, you may be reading this and thinking, “Wow, that sounds AMAZING,” and sure, it is… for like three days. Then you get bored. And then you realize that casual sex has become boring and you kind of freak out and wonder where you left your balls. But I digress…

HOW THIS APPLIES BACK HOME: Pretty obvious, really. In the US, the conventional wisdom is that both men and women are horny and love sex… but men are always THINKING about it and women don’t mind going without it for a few weeks or even a few months.

Well, of course we’re always thinking about it, we don’t know when we’re going to get it again! Women can have it almost any time, so they don’t worry about it. Common sense, really. But it’s interesting to see that when the tables turn, so do the attitudes.

Right Place, Wrong Time

This realization is far more useful. And that’s this… I’m getting approached by 20-40 women per week. If I go into Patong, add another 10-20 approaches per night to that. That’s THEM approaching ME. It’s constant. To the point where I barely even notice it happening anymore.

What’s interesting is the reaction I’ve begun to develop to all of the approaches done on me. And that is that it has very, very little to do with the girl. Unless she’s particularly hot (which is rare), it almost never matters what she says, what she does or what she looks like. If I’m not in the mood to look for a girl or if I’m not in the mood for sex, I don’t bother.

To put it plainly, her success is determined more by my mood than by her or her approach. If I’m in a rush, or going to the gym to train, or thinking about a bunch of business stuff, and some girl starts talking to me, my immediate knee-jerk reaction is to find a polite way to get her to stop talking to me. It’s not that I don’t like her. It’s not that she’s a bad girl. It’s often not even that she’s not attractive. It’s just that I’m not in the mood. Leave me alone.

This mindset is a luxury (obviously) because I know there will be more coming around any minute.

On the other hand, when I do decide I want a girl (which is becoming less and less frequently, see above), it literally takes like two minutes to get one. One Saturday night, me and this Canadian guy went into Patong. We had just finished six days of grueling Muay Thai fighting and were looking — in classic American fashion — to get hammered and get laid. We pounded some shots, looked around and saw two hot Thai girls dancing on one of the poles near the dance floor. My Canadian friend said, “Dude, let’s jump up there and dance with them.” My first reaction was, “there’s no way they’ll let us do that.” And then I stupidly remembered where I was.

We jump up there, and the girls immediately get these gigantic smiles and start dancing with us. They were two random Thai girls out having fun in a tourist area, hoping to land some tourist guy. We were those tourist guys.

We danced with them for about 10 minutes, grinded on them, and then we got down and left. Why? It wasn’t because the girls were ugly. It wasn’t because we didn’t like them. It was because we could. There will be more, so why not?

HOW THIS APPLIES BACK HOME: I had always kind of suspected this about really hot girls, but it wasn’t until I experienced the other side of the coin over here until I truly realized it… but often your success with any particular girl — especially really hot girls — is more determinant on her willingness and receptiveness to men IN GENERAL than your specific approach or the way you present yourself.

In other words, the hotter the girl, the bigger the crap shoot. You have to catch her in a receptive mood and/or really do something unique that she isn’t used to. Which brings me to my next shift in mind-set.

Show Me Something Good

I think if you took half of the Thai girls who have approached me, made them fluent in English and dropped them in a US city, they’d pick up a guy in about 30 seconds flat. They’re cute. Some of them are hot. They often have fun personalities and attitudes. And they’re RIDICULOUSLY aggressive.

But I have to say, this trip has really made me sympathize with women back home in one way: having to put up over and over again with people approaching you and bringing absolutely nothing interesting or attractive to the table. It gets tedious and frustrating. And it’s nothing personal either. It’s not that these girls are bad people. It’s just they’re offering me nothing.

Like I’ll just be hanging out with my guy friends, having some beers (I know, I know… guy’s night out… no girls allowed), and some random girl will come over, plop herself on my lap, tell me I’m handsome… and… and… and… that’s it. She’s got nothing else. She just kind of sits there.

This is the female version of the “approach and ask boring interview questions” syndrome. And it fails on all but the most truly desperate.

This is going to sound so lame… but I would KILL for a girl to have some sort of awesome hobby or interest or passion, or be able to talk to me about something new and interesting. But in all of my time here, I’ve only met one hot Thai girl like this (she lives down the block) and guess what? She has some 30-year-old American guy from California who spends 8 months a year down here with her. He’s a cool guy too… not one of these creepy old men that you see down here sometimes.

And why does she have a guy like that? Because she’s fucking awesome! She’s cool as shit. She’s funny. She has personality, and she can talk about cool things. She taught me how to pry sticky rice out of bamboo bark. She showed me how they shake coconuts out of the trees. She lent me her motorbike for a day. And she didn’t have to. She wasn’t trying to get into my pants (read: wallet). She’s just a really cool girl, and that’s reflected in the fact that she’s one of the few lucky Thai girls that’s landed a Western guy.

I realize there’s a language barrier here, so I can’t be too hard on these girls. But I’ve been on the other side of that fence too. When you’re the seducer, it’s YOUR JOB to come up with exciting and engaging ways to communicate. You don’t just plop down and say, “Here are my tits.”

For what it’s worth, this is why I don’t like strip clubs in the US. You’re basically paying an obscene amount of money to have a pretty girl sit on your lap and display her complete lack of enthusiasm and personality for a quiet and desperate, tiny world to see.

HOW THIS APPLIES TO BACK HOME: Have something going for you. I say this in pretty much all of my products and coaching seminars, but ask yourself this: What makes you different from the last 10 guys who talked to her? What makes you more unique, more special, more attractive? If you can’t quickly and easily answer that, then you aren’t ever going to cut it with the hotter girls. It sounds cold, but here in Thailand, if she has nothing to say, if she can’t actually try and engage me on an emotional level and actually PRETEND to give a shit, then I get up and walk off, no questions asked. It’s nothing personal. It’s just that I can.

Well back home, if you approach girl after girl and they just keep walking off. Then chances are you aren’t showing anything to them other than, “I have a penis, and I think you’re hot.” That’s nice, but WHAT ELSE?

Persistence Pays Off

Where I’ve ended up in the last two weeks is this kind of weird place of comfortable celibacy. Well, to a degree. I hooked up with a couple tourists. But they actually, you know, required being picked up and that was fun and exciting and genuine and involved more than just being white.

But other than that, I’ve been pretty asexual towards the Thai women the last half of my stay here. But there are two notable exceptions. Rose and Kwan.

Rose works at the bar down the road from me. About a month ago, she said hello as I walked past and smiled. This is completely ordinary, not just for Thai women, but Thai culture in general (unbelievably friendly culture, really… but anyway). I didn’t think anything of it and kept going. As the days passed, she continued to say hello and one day invited me to come sit down. She poured me a drink and didn’t charge me for it. She then poured herself one and came and sat next to me. She told me I was very handsome.

Physically, she’s a little over-the-hill. Probably in her early 30’s which, with the competition here, is WAY too old. Nice body, bad face.

We chatted. Her English was poor, but the message was obvious: she really liked me. I was a gentlemen, but took a pass. As the days went by, her hellos turned into hugs, and the hugs turned into her (literally) chasing me down the street telling me that she misses me and wants to see me. She offered to be my girlfriend. I said no thanks. Days turned into weeks, and this continued, day after day. At this point all of the other girls at the bar would shout her name when I walked by so that she wouldn’t miss me. They were rooting for her. It was kind of a game, and I have to admit, it was flattering and the attention was nice now and again.

And although I never slept with Rose, I’ll tell you this. There were 1-2 nights when I was alone in my room, kind of tired and kind of horny. And the thought, “I could just walk down the street and grab Rose,” crossed my mind. She was always option number one. And honestly, if she had been maybe 2-3 years younger, I probably would have taken it. And all because she was persistent. She was in my face constantly. Constantly rejected (always be a gentleman when you reject girls), but always trying again.

Kwan on the other hand, was shy. She was a waitress at the main restaurant I went to every day. For the first two weeks or so, she’d smile at me and say hello, but that was it. I figured she didn’t speak English well. She was very cute, but very young (I think only 18). Every now and then I’d glance up and catch her looking at me. She’d smile, but then get very shy and look away. It was genuinely cute.

She was a good girl. Never went to bars, and obviously was fairly inexperienced to flirting with western guys.

Note: Thai girls fall into three categories… good girls, bar girls and prostitutes. Prostitutes are prostitutes, although sometimes they won’t charge if they like you. Good girls are just that, good girls. They only want a boyfriend and no shenanigans. And bar girls are some strange mixture of the two that I haven’t totally figured out. They’re basically hot Thai girls that their families and friends encourage them to hang around bars to land a rich westerner. Sounds fucked up, but when you figure $500 can feed an extended family for months, then it’s a good investment. A lot of times bars will use them to come over and con drinks out of you. Other times, they’ll go home with you if they like you, but you have to pay the bar the salary she’s giving up by leaving. The idea is that the bars get cute girls to attract foreign guys. The girls get plenty of opportunities to meet foreign guys. And the foreign guys basically get women all over them everywhere they go. Everyone’s happy… or something.

Anyway, it wasn’t until my last week here that Kwan opened up to me. In fact, it started by her asking if Rose was my girlfriend because she was always hugging me. It began as an innocent conversation about Rose and turned into me explaining what I explained in this article: that picking girls as if they’re an item on the menu is no fun, that I want a girl who has something more, some personality. Not just looks.

Kwan lit up like a goddamn Christmas tree and became very excited. She came and sat by me, put her hand on my arm and exclaimed, “Mark, you good boy! I like! You good man!” Her English suddenly became pretty decent. Apparently all this time she was just intimidated to talk to me. But now she was excited to. She still looked at me the same way and smiled even wider now. We sat and chatted for a while, flirting a little, but very coyly. She is still shy after all.

Unfortunately, I left for Bangkok the next day. Frankly, I don’t even know if anything could have happened if I tried. But I will say this, despite being approached dozens of times, she is actually the only Thai girl I can say that I became legitimately attracted to the last week I was in Phuket.

HOW THIS APPLIES TO BACK HOME: Two things: persistence pays off and the dark horse effect. Since really hot women have so many options all the time, and since the determining factor of which guy gets her is based on HER more than it is on YOU, it’s a matter of putting yourself in the right position as often as possible.

I had heard stories from guys before about how they would call a girl for 3-4 weeks before she’d finally pick up. If she’s turning you down because it’s right place, wrong time, then you just need to keep trying until it is the right time.

The other effect is the dark horse. The dark horse is being the guy who is around and available, although he’s not being pushy… he’s biding his time until he sees an opening.

You have to be very careful with the above though… there are traps you can fall into. Don’t mistake being persistent with being obnoxious. There’s a difference between her being attracted but not interested and her just not being attracted at all. You need to notice that difference.

And the other is that I could easily see a guy let himself fall into the Friend Zone and convince himself that he’s really just the dark horse. The dark horse is never a friend. He’s just a guy who’s around and in touch, but waiting to make his move.

All in all, hopefully these perspectives can help you see how a hot girl walks through the world on a day-to-day basis. I had understood or thought some of these things on an intellectual level before, but it wasn’t until I came out here and lived it that I really FELT the shift in mentality that this reality brings.

If anything, this should help you at least understand where she’s coming from if things don’t work out in your favor. As for me… as much as I love Asia, I can’t wait to get back to Western girls. This experience has taught me one thing: I love to be the chaser and I hate being chased.

So until next time, enjoy the chase…

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48 Responses to Life Through the Eyes of a Beautiful Woman

  1. Leo says:

    Well, the same kinda happens when you talk to a bimbo in USA. You say to yourself: this girl is hot, pretty but she’s soooo stupid. On the other hand the other not so pretty girl is more interesting and fun and she gets my attention and I want to make the effort to chase her.

  2. Mark Manson says:

    It really is amazing the entitlement a lot of women feel based on their looks (again, just look at strippers).

    After spending time here, I see how men can have that with money. You get some rich successful lawyer, and he meets some girl and can just have an attitude of like, “Well, I don’t have to be interesting, I don’t have to be engaging, I make $600k a year.”

    In the end, that kind of behavior will only be accepted by the kind of people you don’t want to end up dating.

    • marvelous says:

      I got this all the time in college! I just recently graduated, and as a student I worked as a server and bartender at Morton’s The Steakhouse. At least a couple times a month, usually bartending, I’d get a lawyer/doctor/entrepreneur/etc. ask me on a date after various displays of wealth while they ate their $250 dinner. I was always amazed at how these 50-year-old, balding, uninteresting men thought they could land a 21-year-old, attractive, ambitious college student. Sometimes they were friendly enough, but just, ugh, no, not at all sexually appealing. Least favorite part about that job.

  3. Peter says:

    bahaha. I spend a lot of time in Thailand because my dad lives over there. I totally laughed when the girl said “you good boy. i like” because they say that stuff all the time and their accent is totally adorable.

    Also, a lot of bar girls and prostitutes have Thai boyfriends in the country but like having rich westerners to take care of them in the city.

  4. AC says:

    Thailand is pretty messed up for the girls too. I went a couple of years ago with my hot (and Asian) roommate. A white guy in Patong literally walked up to her and asked “How much?”. She flipped out, said “I’m American asshole”, and proceeded to chew the guy out.

    Imagine if you were a girl and you got treated like a hooker randomly several times a week.

    • Dex says:

      “I’m American asshole”… Funny but I had to look twice. The first time I read it as “I’m an American asshole”. :-)

      “and proceeded to chew the guy out”… this is one big difference between Western woman and Thai women. From what I have seen and read, Thai women are polite and most likely will not get angry. They might be offended but I doubt they would “chew the guy out”. Personally, I think it makes them more civilized.

      The first time I went to Bangkok, I was only there for a week on an extended stop-over from Japan. Within 2 days, I had a gorgeous girl for company and we were together for the next 5 days until I had to leave. They were the best 5 days I had for a very long time. I am going back for a month in January to meet her again… can hardly wait. Oh yeah, the only reason it took 2 days was because I was booked on an all-day tour the first day starting at 6:45am.

      Yep! Thailand is definitely THE best place to attract gorgeous women.

  5. Xander says:

    I’d like to point out that nothing in your post refutes what you lay forth in the first paragraph – that attractive women have it ridiculously easy. Dealing with the mild annoyance of boring dudes pales in comparison to the benefit of having the entire world roll over for you and hand you everything with virtually no effort or achievement on your part. So excuse me while I rub my thumb and forefinger together and play the worlds smallest violin for these poor souls who have to interrupt their busy day of GTL to blow off a couple of feather-boa wearing douches. L’injustice!

    To paraphrase Chris Rock…of course it’s easy for women to turn down sex. Because since they were 13 every man they met has been trying to fuck ’em. “The whole concept is boring at this point.”

    Otherwise an interesting post….

  6. Leo says:

    You didn’t stay in Thailand for too long but you think Thai women have more sex than american women. I remeber you said once that in average the american woman has sex with 7 different guys in her whole life (except the girl from Duke, lol!). Besides, sex for a woman in the western world is taboo (except for the girl from Duke). I’ve met women that feel like a slut after having casual sex. Or they feel used if the guy doesn’t stick around, or they have sex if they only feel something for the guy, etc. Are thai women more laid back about sex in general?

  7. Mark Manson says:

    Xander: From our perspective, yeah, they do have it easy. But I guess the point of the article is that they have a whole different subset of problems and obstacles to overcome…

    Look at the conclusion, I could have had sex with 2-3 girls a day if I wanted, but by the end of the month, I had no desire to sleep with anyone. Instead, I was frustrated that I couldn’t find a girl who seemed to be interested in more than my wallet.

    Leo: The whole culture here is WAAAAAY more relaxed and accepting of sex. That goes for all kinds of sexuality, homosexuality, transgender, etc. There doesn’t seem to be any hang ups about it from the men or the women.

    Just to give you an example, the Muay Thai gym I trained at, the receptionist was a flamboyantly gay guy named “Cha Cha.” And all of the trainers were all these rough and touch kickboxers. Well, these guys would joke around with Cha Cha all the time. Imagine a flamboyantly gay receptionist at a boxing gym in the US who flirted with the trainers and clients. He’d get pummeled.

  8. Leo says:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IuEAP_6CJU

    I remembered I watched this movie after I read your comment.

  9. Pros says:

    Well when you mention that a hot woman back in the USA may politely blow off a guy as a knee jerk because she’s busy etc.

    When a guy plows a but sometimes he can overcome that knee jerk reaction. Its often just an autopilot response. Thats what a lot of community type game teaches that because some chicks are getting hit on a lot they have auto pilot blow offs, if you can use techniques to overcome this you can get a few minutes of her time.

    Did any of the gals in Thailand use false time constraints or qualify you in anyway? Maybe if they did they could have got past your auto pilot blow offs.

  10. Mark Manson says:

    Pros: I heard everything. I would often talk to them for a few minutes. But the whole time I would know that I wasn’t going to do anything with them, because I wasn’t in the mood. She really would have had to WOW me with a lot more than just qualifying me or giving a FTC or something.

    I think you give the techniques more credit than they deserve. See my post “Pick up Techniques don’t matter.”

  11. dude says:

    Any mistaken identity (lady boy) horror stories? 😀

  12. Mark Manson says:

    No horror stories. Although I did get a picture with a lady boy who is hotter than any girl I or you have ever hooked up with. It was actually scary how attractive he/she/it was. So I told him/her/it that I had to get a picture with them.

  13. phazer says:

    Wow this an amazing writeup. However you kinda focused this on really hot girls in America. Probably 9s and 10s. What about girls in the states are are cute/hot etc but don’t always get hit on. Is their reality still the same?

  14. Mark Manson says:

    phazer: No. Think of it as a sliding scale. Hotter she is/more she gets hit on/more options she always has, the more she’s going to naturally have these mentalities.

    And vice-versa of course.

  15. dude says:

    Hahahah I believe you man, my Thai friend tells me that the hottest women in Thailand usually are men.

  16. jeff says:

    I find this very valuable and seems to match what i’ve always thought. (that alot of the differences between men and women relate to circumstance)
    But while attractive women generally get approached more, do you think there is a tipping point (bell curve) where it goes down.
    I’ve always heard that the MOST attractive women usually get hit on less since people are too intimidated to approach or only approach in ego protecting ways(i.e. asking for directions or cat calling.)

  17. Mark Manson says:

    Jeff: I used to think that because when I approached the super hot girls, they were ALWAYS polite and would at least show some sort of appreciation for the fact that I approached them.

    But later when I spent time with some, I realized that they’re that polite because they’re so used to it at this point. I dated a runway model a few years ago and when I was out with her, I literally couldn’t get up and go to the bathroom because every time I’d come back there’d be 1-2 guys talking to her. She always handled it gracefully though and was never rude to them.

    I’ve had some friends date some seriously high caliber models as well who have said the same thing… some of them have stories that are just absurd.

    So yes, the super hot girls tend to be nicer and more receptive, but that’s BECAUSE they get approached constantly, so they’re used to it. Most of your average “hot” girls only get attention like that when they dress up nice and go to the club… the super hot girls get it 24/7.

  18. Iambrian says:

    What’s interesting about this post of yours is that a year ago, there’s a dude in rsdnation who went to thailand and have the EXACT similiar experience and post the exact same thought. He even said he gets tired of girls approaching him for sex all the time. This actually teaches people one thing, if all you care about is to fuck hot chicks for PURE sex, then go to thailand. Studies have shown that 90 percent of bootcamp failed to help a guy get ONE lay. Why put in so much effort JUST for sex. Imo, go to thailand, fuck to your heart content, then go back here to learn game FOR relationship.

  19. Mark Manson says:

    Yes brian, but this raises a FAR more important question…

    Like what the hell were you doing reading RSDNation? 😉

  20. michael says:

    The biggest question for these super hot girls is actually “will they grow old gracefully and still hold onto their femininity and youthful energy?”

    If a guy is coming from that place where they are angry or resentful that the hot girls they like and approach won’t give them the time of the day, i would tell them to gain some schadenfreude and tell them that one day that girl will loss her looks and if she is the bitch you may think she is, she will end up alone, angry, and resentful of men in the end, as he is now. These guys need to move on, grow up, and evolve. Maybe come back years later and see where these girl are. If the girls are then more receptive, maybe the original issue was them, not the girl, or may the girl evolved into a better person. whatever the reason, it is a win-win. If however, these guys get the same reaction from the girls, while she may have lost some of her looks, then the issue was probably her, and is still her. Since the guy has evolved and grown up, at least it is a win for him. Lose for her.

    Moral of the story: If a guy is getting bad reactions from girls, it could be him or the girls. But he needs to evolve and become a better, more complete person. As long as he works on himself and never strays away from his true purpose, he will always win. Then come back to the women he used to desire, and see if he still desires them. If not, look elsewhere. If yes, then he would be able to find out whether the girl is truly what he thought she was.

    The gift of women is life. The gift of men is death. While men teach women how to deal with and accept the inevitable oblivion of death, women give birth and give meaning and a sense of purpose to men who may be lost.

  21. Iambrian says:

    Haha, not going to lie. I was once brain wash by their shit.

  22. Bobby Rio says:

    great insights man… really made a lot of sense… and captured quite a few different ideas i’ve had floating around my head recently…

    David D always says Attraction isn’t a choice.

    I think Attraction isn’t black or white… it is always just different shades of grey.

  23. Superman says:

    Wonderful post. I’m starting to discover that it pays off for me to read the girls situation before approaching. I’m now doing better because of it. I need to mark down Thailand as a place I have to visit haha.

  24. Nick says:

    This is such an awesome post!, im going to Phukut in late Jan so this works out so well for me.

    • Nick says:

      Also, just first hand how did you tell the difference between thai girls and ‘hot’ lady boys. Its a bit of worry if you’re keen on thai girls.

  25. Mark says:

    It’s all in the shoulders and jaws. They can’t fake that. People will tell you to look for the Adam’s Apple, but there’s very cheap surgery these days to get an Adam’s Apple removed. Also, unless you go into a gay club, you won’t meet any in a night club. They all hang out on the street.

    You can tell the difference. You just have to pay attention… big shoulders + defined jaw + deep voice…

    It’s a shame to, because usually the rest of them is ridiculously hot.

  26. AlphaWolf says:

    Great post, thanks for sharing! I heard about it from the San Francisco Lair

  27. Lyle says:

    I’m really interested in this dark horse effect. Could explain the dark horse’s role in the girls life? How is the dark horse different from a male friend of the girls? Does the dark horse ever hang out with the girl? How does the dark horse show that he’s available – through flirting? How is he in touch with the girl – through phone calls, texts, or something else? This is one of my favorite posts on your site.

  28. Bill says:

    Hi Mark,
    I’m confused by the idea of “persistence”, VS the idea of neediness and scarcity. These are almost polar opposites. For example if you are being persistent, are you not being needy and to available for the woman. I.e do you not have to be somewhat of a challenge for her to value you?

  29. Dawson says:

    I went to the philippines last summer, it’s an absoloutely beautiful place, the people are very warm and friendly but you have gotta tread really carefully socially. It was a very quick learning experience.

    Anyway, this may sound like an exaggeration but you’ll have to take my word for it; you get a good idea of what it must feel like to be famous because you get huge ammounts of attention from everyone.

    All of a sudden every woman in sight thinks your pimp. I could literally say that the majority of chicks would just stare at me curiously and eye me up and down or as vince vaughn puts it eye-fuck the shit out of you.

    It took some getting used to but it was awesome. I mean what twenty-something year old guy wouldn’t get a kick out of that?

    really interesting experience

  30. Darren says:

    Just got back from Rawai Beach in Phuket, and all I can say is wow!
    Very relaxed culture sexually.
    And i couldn’t go anywhere without getting hit on.
    Never had to run any game and got good times any night I went out!
    All guys should check out Phuket for a week to experience what being a “10” is really like.
    Best learning experience ever!

  31. Allie says:

    Mark, this is wonderful. The pathetic and practiced advances of men I meet in bars, (despite “lucky me, another free drink…”) are discouraging and beyond frustrating. The constant onslaught of guys sometimes just competing with each other for attention is almost offensive. They turn you from a possible romantic encounter to some kind of odd man trophy, establishing a weird bar hierarchy. I’m sure Rose made you feel similar and I think you can agree that that kind of behavior is anything but welcomed.

  32. Mysteryguy says:

    Dude, you spent a month in one of the prostitution/sex tourism capitals of the world. Then you extrapolate from that to be an expert on Thai women and Thai culture.

    I’ve lived in Thailand for 8 years. I speak Thai. I run a successful business with Thai suppliers. I’ve had many Thai girlfriends.

    I’m sorry, but most of the girls you slept with are borderline prostitutes and not typical of Thai girls. When I first came to Thailand, I too couldn’t tell the difference. I mean, they don’t even request money from you. Nothing against that demographic btw, it’s hard to compare that type to anything you’ll find in America.

    You should try getting in with middle and upper class thai girls in Bangkok. That is where you will find the real quality. They will virtually never approach you, just like girls in the rest of the world.

    Please don’t get me wrong. If you are a presentable white guy, then the Tha dating market is very nice. It has it’s unique character, but it’s not that much better than other Asian dating marks for white guys. Actually, I think big Chinese cities are best.

    • Mark says:

      You seemed to have completely missed the point of the article. I never claimed to be an expert on Thai culture or even their women. But congratulations on having lived there. We’re all very happy for you.

      The point of the article is to understand how it feels to have roles reversed: when everybody is pursuing you rather than the other way around.

  33. Toni says:

    Would you generelly recommend to make this experience if its possible. Could that change the mindset of a normal guy who is not an “super PUA” in a positive way?

  34. Toni says:

    “Asking himself if he is getting an answer or not?” 😉

  35. AA says:

    This article is a bit misleading in that the only Thai girls who aggressively pursue white guys are the less attractive ones. They are not necessarily prostitutes or after your money, but they’re almost certainly not the hot ones.

    Thais perception of white guys have been formed by the large numbers of white guys who come to the country who are sexual losers and who frequent whores, and worse, who seem willing, even eager, to have sex with some of the ugliest women the country has to offer.

    The result is that we’re seen as the sort of guys who not only hook up with the ugliest women, but who take prostitutes as girlfriends.

    This has, not surprisingly, put a huge dent into our reputation with hot Thai girls, and has had the effect of making white guys a target for the low quality women of the country.

    Don’t get me wrong, a cool young white guy can definitely hook up with some of the hottest Thai girls, but none of these girls will throw themselves at him, and it will be harder than getting with a hot white girl in your own country because you have a stigma to overcome.

    Thailand is the one country where East Asian guys, especially the Japanese, are vastly preferred to white guys, because much better specimens of these guys have been visiting Thailand, creating a much more favorable impression. I basically tell my Asian friends that Thailand is the one country they will feel like kings and where they will get more female attention than white guys.

    Basically, what happened to Entropy is that he got massive attention from the low-quality girls of Thailand, but either is not very discriminating in his choice of women or the ego boost was too delicious for him to admit that the quality was low. This is quite common, actually.

    So going to Thailand is not quite what it feels like to be a hot girl, because hot girls get attention from lots of hot, fantastic guys – probably more so than dorks, because dorks rarely have the confidence to approach hot girls, yet in Thailand as a white guy you will be mobbed by the female equivalent of dorks or worse, but find a somewhat lukewarm reception from the attractive women.

    Sadly, there probably isn’t a place where a guy can feel like a perfect 10, but if there is, Thailand is definitely not the place.

    • Mark says:

      Interesting perspective on Thailand. A couple things:

      1) I don’t think I ever said these were high quality girls. And yes, many of them were ugly and gross. Many of them were OK looking and some of them were cute/hot.

      2) Disagree about the hot girls. They get attention from dorks and losers CONSTANTLY. They also get attention from cool guys. And they get attention from average guys. They just get sexual attention from guys constantly.

      And that… is the point of the article. Not whether Thai girls who want white guys are trashy or not, but that as soon as you have unlimited sexual options, your perspective shifts dramatically.

    • hilanoga says:

      So much misogeny in one reply…

  36. Iago says:

    Mark, first of all I have to say I respect you very much and your site give to me very good advice in my life (I am recommending it to my friends), and in my eyes you are one of the most’s intelligent pickupers I know.

    OK. I understand from an intellectual view your article (and I think you are right, I agree with you) but I have to confess, after I read it I fell VERY BAD!! 3 days past and I FELL VERY BAD during this days.

    Why? I fell like a stupid. I struggle myself to overcome my fear approach, during years, and now, when I finally can speak with an beautiful woman in the street without problem I read your article. And I understand that, from the point of view of a beautiful woman, I am just another one of millions of stupid masculine being that she founds every day and want to fuck her. And she just have to find the polite way to get out of me.

    So, I don’t know what to do now, or what to think. I fell hopeless. (I am exaggerating…). Anyway, I know there are people that have success with hot women. And even there are people that have a lot of success. But I haven’t/ So, I was getting better and better in pick up and motivate to continue approach women , until I read this article…

  37. Chuck says:

    A big question I have is how can travel to a country, a non-European one especially, improve your game and how much? Moreso than training with someone who is a very good coach?

  38. Octavian says:

    Mark,

    I understand the point of this article and I don’t disagree.

    However, tangentially regarding Thailand I want to shed a little light on some things, especially for your readers who want to travel to Thailand. When you say you can go home with ANY Thai girl, it’s not true. It may be true in touristy areas, but if your readers go to Bangkok and see some beautiful University students walking down the street thinking they can pick them up, things will go very badly.

    My family is from Thailand and although I am American through and through, I understand Thai culture. Thailand is a very bifurcated culture of the poor people from the country and the city people. For the most part, they don’t mix. Some of the poor country folk make it into the big city of Bangkok and they work in bars, but they still don’t mix with the city folk.

    They even look different. The city girls are usually fair skinned with delicate features and the country girls are dark, with wide, broad features. Just do a google search of Thai movie stars and you will see that they look nothing like Thai bar girls. Here in the US, you can go into a bar and meet dozens of girls who look like Jennifer Aniston, but you won’t see Thai bar girls who look like Thai movie stars. The beautiful girls in the city do go to clubs, but they go to clubs where only Thais go and they’re just like American clubs – exclusive, hard to get in to, expensive.

    I guess my point is that if you go to Thailand, know the difference. Bar girls will be bar girls. The pretty girls in the big city are a different matter entirely. Forget sleeping with or even dating these girls. You might get lucky and meet a rebellious girl, but chances are they won’t even talk to Westerners who approach them. There are some exceptions, but if a wealthy city girl has a Western boyfriend, it’s because she went abroad for college and met a guy there.

    And Mark – I want to say that I really enjoy your blog. I first came across it when searching for some fashion advice and I read Gill’s excellent articles, probably the best I’ve read anywhere. I especially love the balance on your blog of various advice, not just dating. I’m guessing that dating advice readers form the bulk of your readership but I want you to know that there are those of us who come to your blog for other things. Me personally, I have a lot of struggles in my life. Meeting and dating women is down on my list of concerns. I’ve never really gotten into this pickup artist thing, so it’s all pretty foreign to me. Obviously, my dating life can always go better but I meet and date plenty of women. It’s just meeting the right type of woman is where it’s hard, but even there I feel like if I live my life with authenticity things will work themselves out. It’s the “live my life with authenticity…” part that I’m working on.

    Anyway, I don’t want to get off on too many tangents. Just wanted to say that I know you are launching a dating product, so the last few posts have focused on dating but as long as you maintain the balance I’ll keep coming back. Thanks for the blog.

    • Ermenegildo says:

      Octavian, you are spot on here. As a mid 20s guy who has lived in Asia, the process of going for girls of quality is similar to that of any developed western country. Perhaps even slightly more difficult in Southeast Asia where status is extremely important, along with education and the numbers in your bank account.

  39. Jaydee says:

    hi Mark,

    i just discovered your site via a link from the “10 Things Most Americans Don’t Know About America” (great article) and have read a number of your posts….good stuff! you write very well and offer interesting introspections.

    after reading this post on Thailand, i felt a bit compelled to write some comments, but fortunately, Octavian above covered pretty much all of it. i spent about a year in Thailand and Laos some time ago, and went through much of the kingdom…alone…and with little prospect of meeting girls, unless i wanted to hit the bar scenes, which i did not. as mentioned in Octavian’s post, good luck trying to talk more than casually or hook up with any self respecting Thai woman, for the most part, unless you were in heavily touristed areas. even in BKK, if you wanted to talk to some university girls, fine, but that was pretty much where it ended.

    i do agree that, in many places you could hook up with a girl every night if you wanted to, but that would be girls from upcountry trying to make their success by landing a western guy who would take her home with him. getting out into the country and away from the touristed areas brings you to a much more conservative (and often frustrating!) reality of the culture.

    and Burma…sorry, Myanmar…was Victorian and made Thailand look wild. only the bold or perhaps more western leaning would go out with you, and then often escorted by someone. charmingly frustrating. this was over 10 years ago, and the place has changed quite a bit, but outside of the big cities, things are the same.

    keep up the great work!

  40. GarrettLaLone says:

    Great article Mark! Keep up the good work. This one definitely had me smiling and wanting to see Thailand and the rest of the world.

  41. Wifred says:

    Great piece but no so practically applicable. As the chaser, couldn’t persistence make you look needy? Esp. if she can’t gauge your non-needy sub communication over text for example. This seems to contradict what you said about calling 2-3 times before giving up. If you were Rose and she was you, wouldn’t you have to conclude that she isn’t interested? There’s no way to tell if someone is interested or not and it’s even harder via text/phone. If she sometimes ignores you and sometimes picks up (possibly playing hard to get) do you draw a boundary or do you persist?

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