Your general first-date plans

[Paul]

So I purchased the approach program last week, and funnily enough I accomplished 2 of the 3 goals I wrote in the beginning just this weekend. I danced and made out with a girl I just met, and got 2 dates set up with 2 different girls happening in the same week. One of them is with the girl I made out with, we'll be meeting at a bar for a drink. The second one is a girl I met on the bus, who is really nice and loves coffee so I'll be taking her to a coffee place, then probably followed by some general walking down the busy street of our college.

I am excited for the 2 dates, but still have little experience with "new dates" and feel I am in way over my head. Last time I had a first date was a small coffee date about a month ago from a cold approach, that ended up mostly awkward. I could blame it on my lack of conversation skills or lack of chemistry, but to protect my fragile ego I'd like to think mostly I lacked a general game plan. I've made mistakes my first couple times and wish to learn from them as quickly as possible. Blowing dates with beautiful women sucks!

So I come here to ask, what are your guys' general plans for a first date? What do you typically like to do? What things do you typically like the learn about the girl? What things do you share about yourself? How sexual do you make it (touching, kissing, etc.)?

I've read models probably 3 times and while it helped me in a lot of ways, I can't say it helped with specifics like this. I was just never much able to connect right off the bat with people. I know these are such basic things, but I think I could learn a lot by hearing from the men in this forum. This is one of the few sites whose dating advice I value.

[Trickster]

I'd say general rule of thumb is to stay away from "traditional" dates: dinner, movie. Not that there are anything wrong with these dates when you're going with a girlfriend. But dinner is kinda awkward (not to mention expensive), and movies are awful because you don't talk.

For me, I see the first date as a get to know you affair. I know a chill wine bar that has cheap flights on thursday and plays live music, which is a very relaxed atmosphere. I think the most important thing is to choose a location where you can more easily touch them, provided you feel an attraction and you want to escalate physically. This is why dinner/coffee dates are generally not great.

Have a backup plan, in case things are going well. You can then bounce to a different venue - like the park, or gelato place, or frozen yogurt place, preferably close to your apartment. If things are going really well, then you can bounce to your apt and make a move. At the end of the day, I abide by two principles: keep it simple, and keep it intimate.

[Jon]

Trickster's date is a good one. For evening dates - I pick somewhere with drinks that is interesting and classy. So, wine bar, cocktail bar (with those fancy cocktails with interesting names) rooftop bar if the weather permits, somewhere with live music (as long as its not too loud to talk). Coffee can be fine, but I'd recommend buying coffee and walking in the park.

If you do food, choose something light that can be shared. Cheese and charcuterie plates, tapas, ceviche, oysters are all good options. That makes the food interactive and a topic of conversation.

In terms of conversation, it really varies. Make sure to get some information out of her, and be ready to give out personal information. Some PUAs advise you to be mysterious, but frankly I think that evading talkinga about your personal life makes girls think you are shady. I love an opportunity to talk about family, childhood, best friends. I would avoid topics that are too heavy or depressing though.

Physical contact - as long as she is receptive, light physical contact throughout is good. Go for a kiss if things are going well. I generally won't invite a girl back unless there is some reasonably heavy making out beforehand.

[Matty]

http://therawness.com/becoming-a-renaiss...an-part-2/

Knowing a lot of cool places in your city really gives ur city really gives u an edge. For example, in Seoul, I know that south of the Han river there are a lot of cool free outdoor events. I also know that after the event, Gangnam is a quick cab ride away, where I know of a few casual but unique places to grab a bite to eat. I also know of a very cool hookah bar with a really nice ambience where u can sit on the floor on cushions and get nice and close. Recently, I found an amazing bowling alley slash bar that kind of resembles a winter resort, with a possibly even more romantic cuddle up hookah bar. U get the idea. Get out and explore ur city!

[Docter]

You gotta realize that, if a girl has agreed to go on a date with you (and actually shows up) you've pretty much already won.

See, most girls just want a normal guy. Someone laidback who can just shoot the shit. Someone who will fuck them too. You don't need to say the wittiest things or do the craziest things -- just be normal.

I will repeat that -- just be normal and get to know her... it's really super simple.

Man, I ace most dates I go on but that number is low X_X.

Edit: To answer some of your questions...

1. What do you typically do? Get to know her. Find out if she fits my criteria and just vibe.

2. What do you like to learn about the girl? You must decide this yourself... lol it's funny thats like asking "Hey, what are your opinions because I don't have any of my own." Having opinions is polarizing. Screening is polarizing. Unfortunately, until you start getting success you may not really be able to answer these questions honestly because all you really want is to stick your dick in something, but once you've been around (and I mean like, two girls even) you'll start to notice behaviors/interests that are a turn off to you.

I.E. I've finally decided I won't date a woman who smokes. Mad turn off. I've literally walked away from girls after they pull out a cigarette.

3. What do you share about yourself? Whatever comes up. If she asks about your job, you tell her. If you guys are laughing about childhood embarrassment, you might share one that pops into your head. DO NOT PLAN WHAT YOU WILL SAY because you will seem awkward, tense, and tried. Remember that silence is okay. You'd be surprised how often she will break the silence too.

4. How sexual do you make it? Well, the goal is to fuck her right? You move towards that. Keep the lay as a mental mountain in mind as the date progresses. You learn after awhile how much sexual interest to ramp up/down based on whats going on. I actually just wrote out a whole progression I usually follow, but fuck it, you shouldn't have a roadmap in your head. Just always walk towards the mountain. Remember that girls want to feel desired... that's half of their attraction to you. If you aren't making moves (like resting your hand on her leg to see if she says anything) then she will start questioning herself and you. Always err on the side of too much than too little...

Good luck I hope your date went/goes well!

[Vytas80]

10 years ago I had no idea of all PUA/dating advice and just did my own thing. Approacheds girls in bars, bought them a drink, asked for number, called the next day and asked them out to see a movie. And had a fair share of success. I have even made out with a girl in the movie on a first date without ever reading any PUA related article.

Then 5 years ago, I discovered PUA stuff and it fucked my mind up: "wait 3 days before calling", "dont buy them drinks", "dont do movie dates", "tell stories that demonstrate high value", "act alpha" - for me that doesn't work. I reverted back to my pre-PUA menality that being authentic is way better than beying a Player.

Authenticity is the key. What worked best for me on first dates is doing what I genuinly wanted to do. A few examples of some my recent first dates:

- We went for a walk in the park.
- We went (by car) to the lake that is outside of the city to check if there is already ice on the surface. I asked her to pack some sandwiches and brought some hot tea myself.
- We went to a movie (it was a 50 mins. non-hollywood movie full of weirdness though). Had great a conversation after it. She asked me out to a 2nd date by herself.
- I rented a 2-seat canoe and we paddled on it through the river in the night city. In November. At some point I suddenly ran out of conversation topic so I asked the girl to sing a song. We date to this day.
Also had my fair share of first dates when we just meet in some lounge place, have some wine, snacks and chill and talk. Some were good, some sucked, but it sucked due to lack of attraction not the date scenario itself. I also tend to escalate quickly if a woman shows reciprocation.

My advice for your first dates would be to do thing that you feel like you would genuinly enjoy doing. The key word here is genuinely. You cannot force yourself to enjoy activities. If you will feel good - she will feel good too. If you see signs that she is into you - escalate physically. Take hand, hug her and go for kiss - women love to feel desired. However if nothing excites you (or all that you enjoy is video games and web browsing) - then you need to upgrade your lifestyle or all you can attract will be girls that are into games and web browsing. They are not bad, but usually just not specialy hot. But I believe you deserve better than this.

[IdEngager]

A lot of good advice here. Personally, I have like 3 or 4 bars, and 1-2 coffee shops around the city I like to take a first date. All of them are places I'm familiar and comfortable with and are close (walking distance) to other places to hang... having to hop into any sort of transportation during a first date is a total mood killer to me. I'm totally down to try new things with a date, but the first time I like familiar places cause that's just one less thing to worry about.

Almost all my first dates where I thought "OMG! Big first date!" have gone horrible. I've gone on ones where I didn't really realize it was a date at the time (some girl I sorta knew, and I realize I never hung out with her one on one before) that have gone swimmingly well cause I was relaxed and just shot the shit. It should never feel like an interview when you're talking to her... sometimes it does cause you have no chemistry (it happens), but don't just plan to rattle off questions or rattle off your life story. I usually do some light touching and if it goes way well, it's gone way further, but really just live it in the moment.

[Zac]

Mark actually wrote about this on page 308 in the section on "The Perfect Date" the book Models

[Creatine Dreams]

I usually take my girls to a chicken fight.

It is very polarizing!

Serious answer: I usually take girls to a nice, casual bar. Something that is not too fancy but not too scummy. Preferably a somewhat dark environment.

I always buy the first round. If a girl is interested in me, she usually offers to buy the second round. This type of date has generally worked out for me pretty well. If the conversation is good, stuff usually happens!

[SFCM]

Long, long experience and a lot of bad, expensive, boring dates has taught me that the first date is always something cheap, no more than two hours, and preferably something that doesn't signal a whole lot of interest.

[Paul]

Doctor, your response was embarrassing for me to realize, but true. I really have no "opinion" of my own yet because I haven't been with enough attractive women to want to genuinely screen them. Sure, I could ask some canned screening questions, but I probably wouldn't genuinely care about the answer since I didn't think of it myself. I hope one day that may come, but my current situation is I haven't had sex for 9 months and am sexually frustrated as hell.

Zac, I did realize models had a section on the dating process, I guess I just wanted to everyone's opinions as well. I think I started this thread mostly out of nervousness for my upcoming dates, and fear that they would turn out like the one a month ago. But now that I had one of the dates already, I see it was more a lack of chemistry than a lack of game-plan.

For anyone who's wondering, the bar date went well. Even a little bit of alcohol REALLY helps for the first-date jitters, for both people. I felt some chemistry, conversation flowed most of the time, we had some laughs, ya know One thing I'm trying to get over is always having to fill uncomfortable silences. I would sit there silently like I'm expecting her to say something, and she would reestablish conversation. Earth-shattering revelation for me (half-serious...). We got ice cream afterwards and made out a little at the end. It took me a while to muster the courage to kiss her, but I'm working on my sexual shame and intend to push much more next time. It was hilarious because this was the girl I met at a rave and made out with, but in a normal setting it was like that had never happened and I was back to square one. The 2nd date with her and the 1st date with the other have been postponed until we're all done with finals, so still waiting on those.

Great replies so far, thanks guys!

[Todd1]

At Paul, I noticed you mentioned that you were in college. I'm also a college student and have been having anxiety about taking women on dates. Not that I should care, but it doesn't seem like the social norm in college.

Most of the women I have had sex with have been drunken one night stands or women I got to know through friends. Unfortunately there have been a lot of girls who I met in class or at parties, seemed to vibe with, and got their phone numbers but never got around to meeting again.

Are there any real differences in taking a woman on a date in college compared with later in life? I'm wondering if there are better places to go on a date in college than just coffee. I'm not yet 21 so going to the bars is difficult (although that will soon change).

Not sure if I'm over thinking this or if social norms in college really do make dates more awkward.

[don]

Lounge bar... done...