Post Reply 
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Sexual Anxiety
YMZ Offline
Primordial Ooze
*

Posts: 21
Likes Given: 14
Likes Received: 7 in 4 posts
Joined: Feb 2012
Post: #1
Sexual Anxiety
I've read through the stickied thread on insecurities, but felt like this is a broad enough topic that isn't adequately discussed given its apparent prevalence. I feel like, deep down, the root issue is one of shame, and a lot of us could benefit from being more open about sexuality regardless of how much the anxiety currently affects our lives. I would love to hear inputs on my situation, as well as similar experiences in overcoming this anxiety from others.

For me, it's an issue that has become more and more obvious within the past year. As I have gotten better with women and get myself into more sexual situations with more regularity, I've noticed an unhealthy pattern of fear, avoidance, and anxiety. The most superficial anxiety for me, currently, is premature ejaculation.

Growing up, I didn't have a lot of success with women. My upbringing wasn't religious or overly moralistic, but sexuality/dating were not topics for open discussion. While I was generally outgoing and popular, I was always extremely shy to discuss girls, attraction, sex, and any related topics with male friends as guys tend to do at that age. I would clamp up, not from inexperience but from a visceral sense of discomfort. I didn't have a serious girlfriend and didn't lose my virginity until I was 19. Since then (I'm 23), I have been with one other girl.

These days, my friends see my apparent success with girls and ask about how dates go. I find that I am still quite reserved and self-conscious in talking about sexual acts. On the other hand, I've had at least 2 girls in the past month with whom I escalated until it was time to come over or time to have sex, then froze and turned cold. Since I'm now more aware of the limiting effects of my anxiety, I have gotten a bit better at not letting negative emotions run the show. For example, whereas I used to allow that anxiety to mask itself as incompatibility with the girl, or to make me feel like I'm not attracted to the girl, or to divert my attention to school work (etc etc), now I usually just suck it up and just send that text to arrange for time/place.

While I've definitely made strides in awareness, I nonetheless still struggle with performance anxiety, which no doubt contributes to my problem with premature ejaculation. It got to the point, last night, that I pulled a girl away while she was giving me a blowjob within the first 10 seconds because I was about to lose it. At this point, I think the anxiety is mostly due to living up to a certain image that I (or society) have for myself in terms of performance - rather than, for example, any caretaker behavior on my part in wanting to please my partner. FWIW, I've done a porn free run of 50 days, and currently use PMO once or twice a week. I've tried focusing on my breathe and relaxing (to the best of my ability) during sex to no avail.

I know the issue is all in my head as is true with all types of anxiety. However, too often this topic is concluded with that exact reply - "it's all in your head". I'd love to hear everyone's input on the issue, focusing on practical things you've done that's specifically helped sexual performance or sexual anxiety in general. For example, does anyone have experience with therapy or psychoanalysis? Other than that, I think a discussion of sexual history and experiences that led to overcoming anxiety would be helpful as well.

Let's get this topic in the open guys.
03-30-2012 04:53 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Creatine Dreams Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 761
Likes Given: 118
Likes Received: 126 in 90 posts
Joined: Mar 2012
Post: #2
RE: Sexual Anxiety
I am not the most experienced dude on this forum but here are my two cents.

First of all, great job on ditching the porn. That was a great decision on your part.

Second of all, I don't think that you should be that concerned about not lasting that long the first time you have sex with a girl during a sexual session. A lot of times you will just not last that long. But the second time you have sex with a girl during a sexual session is where you can do your work. I have found that I often last 5 minutes during my first time having sex with a girl and then last 20 minutes to 45 minutes during the second time. So don't feel bad.

Third, How much foreplay are you engaging in? You might want to increase it a little bit so you get used to having a hot naked woman around you. That way you may last longer when you actually do the deed.

Fourth, do you give the girl oral sex? As long as you take care of her needs in some way, I think you will be ok.

Anyways, those are my thoughts and I hope they will help you.
03-30-2012 06:06 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Chaos Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 709
Likes Given: 285
Likes Received: 322 in 172 posts
Joined: Nov 2011
Post: #3
RE: Sexual Anxiety
1) it's not such a big deal. Trust me, you might feel like a big failure but is not a big deal.
2) A lot of guys think premature ejaculation is not what it is. 10 second is, but 5 minutes isn't, altthough I know from experience it can be pretty frustrating. As you have more sex, get older and get more confident in bed you endurance will improve.
3) it's OK to stop!! Just switch to a little foreplay, she'll love it anyway. Also it's ok if she doesn't come. I know, that sound harsh but you have to give yourself some space... It's perfectly fine, it happens to all of us and it isn't that big a deal...
4) If you're still worried about it, make her come first, via oral sex, fingering or whatever... It will take a lot of pressure out of you... Now after that she might not be in the mood for more sex, but the next time you'll feel like "things are even" and paradoxically that will take a lot of pressure off you and you'll perform better. On the other hand if she's up for more sex, either right after or a couple of minutes, then you'll feel quite relaxed, after all she already came once.
5) I know there's a lot of pressure on us to perform admirably the first time, but the crude fact is that most times the first time is a discovery process that sucks... Specially if you rush it... So just try to stop thinking about it as a test to your manhood and try to enjoy the process, even if you come and she doesn't. If that's the case just make her come any other way you like and don't make a big deal out of it, she won't either... I don't when things go the other way around (that happens too) and honestly I don't want to know anything about a girl that does.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 07:00 PM by Chaos.)
03-30-2012 06:59 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 7 users Like Chaos's post:
Creatine Dreams (03-30-2012), Edmond Dantès (03-31-2012), FirstAidKit (04-01-2012), Guyintheback (03-30-2012), Mark (03-30-2012), Tim (03-30-2012), YMZ (03-31-2012)
Mark Online
Non-Dual
*******

Posts: 2,018
Likes Given: 485
Likes Received: 699 in 389 posts
Joined: Mar 2012
Facebook LinkedIn Twitter YouTube
Post: #4
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Some of the best sex doesn't involve orgasms at all. I used to put a lot of performance pressure on myself, "I have to last a long time, I have to make her cum, I have to make it dynamic and exciting." It made the anxiety a lot worse.

Sex is like anything else, you have on days and off days. Sometimes you can't be stopped, everything is amazing. Other days, your parts just aren't working that well, or you're distracted or stressed.

What I've discovered is getting to a place with your partner where you both are OK and like each other regardless of what happens is more important than the quality of sex itself.
03-30-2012 08:41 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 1 user Likes Mark's post:
Creatine Dreams (03-30-2012)
Jon Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 738
Likes Given: 22
Likes Received: 151 in 104 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #5
RE: Sexual Anxiety
One thing I found is that the more sex you have, the more you learn how to pace yourself and draw things out - what positions you can do for a while, what positions you have no endurance with, etc.
03-30-2012 08:43 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Mark Online
Non-Dual
*******

Posts: 2,018
Likes Given: 485
Likes Received: 699 in 389 posts
Joined: Mar 2012
Facebook LinkedIn Twitter YouTube
Post: #6
RE: Sexual Anxiety
(03-30-2012 08:43 PM)Jon Wrote:  One thing I found is that the more sex you have, the more you learn how to pace yourself and draw things out - what positions you can do for a while, what positions you have no endurance with, etc.

True. I learned that if I was having a lot of anxiety or if I was drunk and having trouble getting it up, putting her on top of me and laying on my back always gets it up pretty quickly. Then once I'm up and going, I can switch to another position.

Took me like a year to figure that one out, hahaha...
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 08:46 PM by Mark.)
03-30-2012 08:46 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Tim Offline
Esteem
****

Posts: 1,040
Likes Given: 228
Likes Received: 414 in 244 posts
Joined: Nov 2011
Post: #7
RE: Sexual Anxiety
(03-30-2012 06:59 PM)Chaos Wrote:  1) it's not such a big deal. Trust me, you might feel like a big failure but is not a big deal.
2) A lot of guys think premature ejaculation is not what it is. 10 second is, but 5 minutes isn't, altthough I know from experience it can be pretty frustrating. As you have more sex, get older and get more confident in bed you endurance will improve.
3) it's OK to stop!! Just switch to a little foreplay, she'll love it anyway. Also it's ok if she doesn't come. I know, that sound harsh but you have to give yourself some space... It's perfectly fine, it happens to all of us and it isn't that big a deal...
4) If you're still worried about it, make her come first, via oral sex, fingering or whatever... It will take a lot of pressure out of you... Now after that she might not be in the mood for more sex, but the next time you'll feel like "things are even" and paradoxically that will take a lot of pressure off you and you'll perform better. On the other hand if she's up for more sex, either right after or a couple of minutes, then you'll feel quite relaxed, after all she already came once.
5) I know there's a lot of pressure on us to perform admirably the first time, but the crude fact is that most times the first time is a discovery process that sucks... Specially if you rush it... So just try to stop thinking about it as a test to your manhood and try to enjoy the process, even if you come and she doesn't. If that's the case just make her come any other way you like and don't make a big deal out of it, she won't either... I don't when things go the other way around (that happens too) and honestly I don't want to know anything about a girl that does.

Chaos kills it here...

Couple of things to add.

1) Kegels. Google this, but basically they're exercises that, after a few weeks of doing them, will make you last way longer. I went through a phase of premature ejaculation with my first girlfriend where I was literally lasting 10 seconds inside her or less. My confidence was at an all-time low because of it. I did kegels for a couple of weeks and then the next time we slept together, I lasted for something like 30 to 45 mins. It was insane. I had a female friend who offhandedly mentioned her boyfriend was letting her down in bed and I recommended he try this. A couple of weeks later I saw her and she gave me this very serious look and said 'those exercises are amazing'. Don't use that to put pressure on yourself to last a long time though; like Chaos said the average time for actual intercourse is 5 minutes. And just because it goes longer than that doesn't make it better.

2) Performance is generally all about confidence and comfort. If you're not feeling comfortable with the girl you're with, that should probably be something you focus on first. Read some of the posts on these boards about vulnerability, or 'Models', or do the new connection program. If it's about confidence, try focusing on something you know you're good at in bed. For me that's fingering a girl. I have so many experiences where I drove a girl absolutely crazy doing this that I can just revert back to it and know I'm going to rock her world. Nothing gives you confidence like when you've just done that. Then if I come too soon or can't get it up, I know that she's still going to be thinking about how amazing the first part was anyway.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 09:45 PM by Tim.)
03-30-2012 09:45 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 1 user Likes Tim's post:
Chaos (03-30-2012)
Creatine Dreams Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 761
Likes Given: 118
Likes Received: 126 in 90 posts
Joined: Mar 2012
Post: #8
RE: Sexual Anxiety
(03-30-2012 08:41 PM)Mark Wrote:  Some of the best sex doesn't involve orgasms at all. I used to put a lot of performance pressure on myself, "I have to last a long time, I have to make her cum, I have to make it dynamic and exciting." It made the anxiety a lot worse.

Sex is like anything else, you have on days and off days. Sometimes you can't be stopped, everything is amazing. Other days, your parts just aren't working that well, or you're distracted or stressed.

What I've discovered is getting to a place with your partner where you both are OK and like each other regardless of what happens is more important than the quality of sex itself.

Yeah, the whole "I need to have an orgasm" thing is something I may need to get over. Usually when I fuck a girl for the first time in a session, I last 5 to 10 minutes. The second time however, I can last indefinitely. Sometimes, I don't really want to go on but I keep fucking her just so I can cum. That might not be the right approach.

On a random sidenote, I do not know if this has ever happened to you guys, but sometimes, I have trouble finding the hole (especially if I am drunk). Usually, I will just ask the girl to guide me in but this can be embarrassing!
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 10:31 PM by Creatine Dreams.)
03-30-2012 10:30 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Halo Effect Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 597
Likes Given: 174
Likes Received: 314 in 152 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #9
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Quote:I've read through the stickied thread on insecurities, but felt like this is a broad enough topic that isn't adequately discussed given its apparent prevalence. I feel like, deep down, the root issue is one of shame, and a lot of us could benefit from being more open about sexuality regardless of how much the anxiety currently affects our lives. I would love to hear inputs on my situation, as well as similar experiences in overcoming this anxiety from others.

I agree, YMZ. I have a history of sexual shame and fear of escalation, but I am now at a point in my life where I am very comfortable with my sexuality and I have no fear of sexual escalation at all anymore. I'll tell about my history and the steps I took to get to where I am now.

My history

I have always had the trait that I don't want to do anything that I am unskilled at. I can't dance, so I don't dance. But how will you learn how to dance if you never dance? You just won't dance, period.

So when I got to the age where I started to like girls, and girls started liking me, and the time came where we should kiss, I would completely shut down. In my early teens I just felt angry at the girl for wanting to kiss me (no self-awareness yet). In my mid-teens I realized that it was pure fear: fear of humiliation and embarassment, fear of failure and fear of the unknown. (What if I did it completely wrong and she would be shocked with how bad I was? Never-ending shame?!!). After some embarassing missed opportunities (girl all over me, me feeling like there was a bag of bricks in my stomach and sweating and unable to do anything, until the girl thought I rejected her), my insecurity grew and eventually girls disappeared from my life entirely. I just spent my teen years in my room.

During this period, I also "discovered" porn. I start watching porn at a young age, probably at 13. I felt shame about my sexuality. Both masturbation and porn always left me with a feeling that I did something bad; that I was bad. My whole life, I had always been a very good boy. Obedient, kind, honest. A good momma's boy. I wanted to be pure, and I believed that raw sexuality was bad. Yet I watched this dirty porn and had these dirty thoughts. So I tried to repress it. In my daily life I was a perfectly nice boy, lacking any defined identity. When the sexual desire became too strong to surpress, I secretly indulged in porn. Or rather, my sexuality simply took over.

The thing with sexual desire is that it cannot be repressed. It's too strong for that. It's a very real part of who you are; a natural, healthy part of who you are. If you try to repress it, it just goes underground and comes out in unwanted and less functional ways. So my normal porn watching (to the extent that watching hardcore pornography at the age of 14 is normal) quickly escalated to more extreme stuff. Desensitization also played its role. And I now believe that the fact that I was such a good boy with a strong conscience actually contributed to my more extreme porn-watching. When I watched stuff that I knew was "bad", the arousal I felt was incredible. There was an incredible rush while I explored the more questionable parts of the internet, which made the pleasure much greater. Even though I hated it. I felt awful afterwards, but during the porn-watching, my sexual desire took over control.

Pretty soon I would watch things that not only I thought were bad, but that I knew "society" disapproved of, too. Of course I tried to repress the tendency to look for the extreme porn, but the desire would always win out eventually. This improved my shame considerably. I thought that if anyone knew the truth about me, they wouldn't see a good, honest boy anymore, but something repulsive. So this made me hide myself even more. Which made me even less likely to succeed with girls. It reduced my self-esteem more, which made me believe that I was undesirable to girls. The fact that girls were so out of reach made me believe that normal sex was just not an option, which escalated my porn-viewing further. It was a nasty cycle of ever-increasing low self-esteem, shame and fear.

Breakthrough

Now, I said that I am doing great now, so you probably wonder how I got to this point. There are several important steps. First of all, I read and watched a lot of self-help and self-improvement stuff. I read up on spirituality and sexuality. I analyzed myself and my desires. I hypothesized that if I believed that normal women would want sex with me and if I could express my sexuality in a healthy way (in a sexual relationship with a girl), while learning to accept my sexuality, that this whole dysfunctional porn-viewing habit would resolve itself.

It wasn't until the age of 20 that I kissed a girl - a single kiss when I was quite drunk with a Spanish girl while I was on vacation. Later that year I traveled to Australia and Thailand. I thought the situation with my sexual anxiety was hopeless, so I did one thing that I thought would help. I paid for sex with a Thai woman. It was an awful experience, but at least I learned that sex is actually pretty simple and not scary.

It was almost two years later that I had my breakthrough. I went on two different vacations in the summer, for a total of four weeks, going out almost every night. I had devoured a lot of pick up advice by now. I had worked out, had a better hair cut, got a great tan, and girls started showing interest in me. My looks helped me out, because some girls actually approached me. I kissed a bunch of them, and after like five of them, I started to "get it". Since then, I wasn't scared of kissing anymore, because I felt I knew how to do it. Also had sex with a girl who was equally sexually inexperienced and more or less pushed on to me by her girl friends.

That summer improved my confidence a lot, both the confidence in my attractiveness to girls and in my sexual escalation skills. After that vacation I got my first sexual relationship, with a girl I had met during that vacation. By now I started buying products about how to get good in bed, especially David Shade's stuff. I would always try to make the sex better than the time before that. I would always try to push myself out of my comfort zone. I tried to be more dominant each time, and try out new techniques and give her more pleasure. I dated her for about a year, and during this year I became quite good at sex, dirty talk, dominance.

I absolutely advise to get a longer term girlfriend or sex partner to overcome shame and get more comfortable with sex. You will naturally get more comfortable as you spend more time with each other. Read up on what it means to be good in bed (try David Shade or Daniel Rose, for starters. Hint: Being good in bed is mostly psychological and emotional, not physical.) Make sure that you communicate openly and honestly with the girl. Be fucking vulnerable. Shame doesn't like to be exposed. Vulnerability and honesty met with empathy and understanding destroy shame. Make sure that the girl is also open and honest, and that she is supportive. If she is not a supportive, kind person, go find a new one. Beware though: the extent to which a girl is open and kind depends, to a large degree, on how open and kind you are.

So I got my first girlfriend, had regular sex, I dared to express my real sexuality more and more with this girl. To my great pleasure, my hypothesis held up: The more I expressed my sexuality in a natural, good way, the less extreme porn I needed to watch.

Overcoming the shame

But I still had this shame bottled up inside of me. One thing I did was read books like Nancy Friday's My Secret Garden. It's a book filled with real women's fantasies, from the seventies. It is an eye-opener, because you learn that women are every bit as sexual as we men are, and possibly moreso. And it teaches you that it's okay to have sexual fantasies, even if they are weird or dirty or perverted. Other sources, like David Shade and Hypnotica and Brad P also taught me that it is normal, natural and healthy to be sexual. It's good to be sexually dominant. In fact, women love a sexual man.

At one point I decided that I would go to a psychotherapist to talk about my porn history and shame. I confessed all the dirty shit I ever watched. It was fucking scary, but I did it. I even gave details of the more disturbing things I had seen. The guy didn't look particularly happy with it (therapists are humans too, it turns out, and not all of them gladly discuss these subjects), but I felt very proud of myself that I did it. It felt good to share that which I had hidden for so long.

I kept learning more about sexuality and shame. I kept thinking about it and I kept sharing more and more with girls. One crucial thing is that I learned to become more and more vulnerable in bed. What I mean by this is that I would express my real desires, even though it was scary. Scary because she might reject me and judge me. The opposite happened every time. You would be amazed at how open-minded and non-judgmental girls are, especially if you are the same to them. The sex got better and better as I became more assertive.

At one point I struggled with the idea of whether I should just deal with all this sexual shame and my porn history privately, or if I should share all of myself with a girl and tell her everything. I went to a sexologist to talk about this, and also to talk about the shame once more. He was an extremely chill dude, very accepting and non-judgmental. He saw guys who had gone through the exact same thing as I had all the time. I further learned to accept myself with him.

I recently met a girl who matched me in being openminded, non-judgmental, accepting and deliciously dirty-minded. We had awesome, dirty sex and I told her everything. Felt great. She was so good. Each and every time I shared my secrets, I felt better about myself and my shame reduced. Each time I was vulnerable like that was easier than the time before.

Uniting your loving side and your dirty side

Another crucial insight for me was that the solution to the problem of having at the same time both the desire to be good, loving and empathic and the desire to be sexual, horny, dirty, dominant is simply this: unite the two. Unite the love with the sexuality. What I had tried to do before was the opposite: I tried to separate my sexuality from the rest of my self by trying to repress it, because I believed that my "dark side" was bad.

Once you completely accept your sexuality, and express your sexuality with love and empathy, you will no longer do anything that you will feel bad about afterwards. You know that feeling when you orgasm after watching dirty porn, and then you feel bad about having watched that porn? If you infuse your sexual lust with empathy and love, then you can still feel all those dirty things, but anything that your conscience disagrees with will be a turn-off. Your "good side" and "dark side" will be one!

The last part is a personal insight, and might sound a little "woo-woo". David Deida (who, admittedly, can be woo-woo, but also very wise) described it like this (the "..." means I skip text. It's from The Way of the Superior Man, chapter 36: Own Your Darkest Desires.):

Quote:When you are unable to express your dark passions with love, then they go underground in your psyche. Your dark desires become disconnected from your heart. Instead of being moved to embrace your woman with masculine force and aggressive passion ... you begin to fantasize about controlling and dominating women in unloving ways.
...
The desire to ravish is the desire to break through a woman's resistances to open her heart and body into ecstatic loving.
...
When this masculine desire to ravish becomes dissociated from your heart, then you will settle for breaking through a woman's resistance without love, through violance or coercion.
...
Your woman surrendering to receive your strong love, or you lovingly "forcing" your woman to surrender into greater ecstacy, is the basis of ravishment. When you are unwilling to play these dark masculine and feminine poles in love and humor, then they will appear in loveless ways, such as rape fantasies, obsession with soap operas, tragic stories of loss and brutality, and violent pornography.

Very powerful. I believe that men who are nice guys in their daily lives, then jerk off to hard porn and then feel guilty afterwards, are men who do not embrace their sexuality and let it go "underground in their psyche", as David Deida describes it. Once you fully embrace your sexuality, especially the dark side of it, and you can express it with love with a woman you respect, then you can realize your desires, while not feeling any shame or disagreeing with any of your actions.

Edit: Uniting your loving side and dirty side goes both ways. First, in bed, you will respect her and empathize with her while expressing your raw, masculine sexuality. Second, in your normal life, you will be masculine and sexual as well as your nice, normal self.
If you are a real Nice Guy, it could be that you are not truly sexual even when you have sex with a girl. You physically go through the motions, but you don't FEEL what you feel when you watch porn. In that case, porn, fantasy and masturbation are the only true outlets for your sexuality. Then you have to learn to express your masculinity and sexuality both outside AND inside the bedroom.

I am not all the way there yet, but if I compare myself now to a few years ago I have made a huge transformation.
(This post was last modified: 03-31-2012 07:14 PM by Halo Effect.)
03-31-2012 04:55 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 11 users Like Halo Effect's post:
baller08 (04-20-2012), bubblegum (10-09-2012), CHB2 (04-20-2012), Creatine Dreams (03-31-2012), deivid (04-01-2012), Dizzy (04-30-2013), Edmond Dantès (03-31-2012), Guyintheback (03-31-2012), Mark (03-31-2012), Salaam (06-21-2012), YMZ (03-31-2012)
Edmond Dantès Offline
Safety
***

Posts: 351
Likes Given: 103
Likes Received: 74 in 51 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #10
RE: Sexual Anxiety
That was an awesome post, dude. Thanks for sharing your experience.
03-31-2012 06:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Guyintheback Offline
Safety
***

Posts: 154
Likes Given: 95
Likes Received: 16 in 12 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #11
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Wow, thanks for sharing that Halo Effect.
I'm going to print that out to save it.
03-31-2012 06:33 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
YMZ Offline
Primordial Ooze
*

Posts: 21
Likes Given: 14
Likes Received: 7 in 4 posts
Joined: Feb 2012
Post: #12
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Incredible post, Halo. I really appreciate your taking out time to write that out for our benefit. It was a wonderful read that resonated with a lot of my experiences with porn and women growing up, and to an extent, now. I'm happy for your transformation, and I'm sure I'll have to read it again to get everything out of it.

While I appreciate the feedback from everyone else, I was really looking for the type of post that Halo delivered. When I said "practical things" in my OP, I didn't necessarily mean tactics to temporarily raise my self-confidence (give her pleasure first, try different positions, etc.) so much as stories of discovery/awareness that eventually led to lessening the shame and anxiety from a more fundamental perspective. I guess that's bad wording on my part. That said, I do appreciate the input all the same.

I was originally asking the question in the context of casual sex and one night stands, where vulnerability and disclosing my sexual shame seemed a bit out of place. However, the more I think about it, the more I think that, instead of looking for casual sex, I should focus more on emotional and supportive connections that allow me to address this sexual shame. As I've read numerous times on this site, it seems that my attention on racking up the notches might be better spent on finding a supportive partner to address these deeper issues.

Edit: Read through again and took out some questions already answered
(This post was last modified: 04-01-2012 02:12 AM by YMZ.)
03-31-2012 07:29 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Halo Effect Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 597
Likes Given: 174
Likes Received: 314 in 152 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #13
RE: Sexual Anxiety
YMZ,

It's completely possible to rack up notches while not reducing your shame at all. The desire to only do one night stand may even be an unconscious strategy to avoid intimacy and dealing with your shame. Sex can be as shallow or as deep as you allow it to be.

Before you share the deepest parts of yourself with a woman, you need to feel that you can trust her. Mutual trust and respect are important. A warmth and acceptance from her are important as well. These can only be developed if you see a person on a regular basis, and not just with any person. Brené Brown says somewhere in her book The Gifts of Imperfection that you don't just share everything with everybody; if you have a few people in your life who you can share everything with, then you are a lucky person.

You are right that disclosing your sexual shame during a one night stand is a bit out of place. Although I must say, if you start to focus more on emotional connection and less on fucking her, then you will find that the quality of your one night stands also improves. You can build a remarkably strong connection with a girl in one night if you open yourself up to it.

But yes, the ancient wisdom that guys who are desperate for a girlfriend are probably better of getting laid more, and guys who want to get laid a hundred times are better off getting a girlfriend holds true here. Smile
04-01-2012 11:21 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 1 user Likes Halo Effect's post:
Antonio (08-30-2012)
Halo Effect Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 597
Likes Given: 174
Likes Received: 314 in 152 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #14
RE: Sexual Anxiety
I think guys who are afraid of being judged for being sexual should take a look at this one. Smile



(This post was last modified: 04-20-2012 01:19 PM by Halo Effect.)
04-20-2012 01:16 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Edmond Dantès Offline
Safety
***

Posts: 351
Likes Given: 103
Likes Received: 74 in 51 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #15
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Halo, you're from now on my official rolemodel for dealing with this issue. Be prepared to be bombarded with a lot of questions soon, haha Smile
04-20-2012 01:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Halo Effect Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 597
Likes Given: 174
Likes Received: 314 in 152 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #16
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Sure, ask away. This is one area where I feel quite confident. Smile
04-20-2012 02:25 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Edmond Dantès Offline
Safety
***

Posts: 351
Likes Given: 103
Likes Received: 74 in 51 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #17
RE: Sexual Anxiety
(03-30-2012 04:53 PM)YMZ Wrote:  [...] While I was generally outgoing and popular, I was always extremely shy to discuss girls, attraction, sex, and any related topics with male friends as guys tend to do at that age. I would clamp up, not from inexperience but from a visceral sense of discomfort.

I just realised that I've got the same problem. But in my case I never really talked much about sex, because of my inexperience. You know, the major belief behind it is that I'm afraid of others finding out that I'm inexperienced with girls and sex in general and that I'll be negatively judged for it and loose my reputation. This is an effect of me opening up about this topic a few years ago. Told some former friends about it and they let my whole school know it and since then I don't like to talk about that topic anymore.

(Seriously guys, this forum is actually the only place where I feel safe to share this stuff with you. Thank you so much for your feedback and the warm, appreciative atmosphere. Without it, I couldn't be vulnerable and actually work and improve on this topic.)

This negative experiences give me a hard to open up myself sexually, both verbal and physically, to girls. I'm asexual around them and this really frustrates me.

So the big question is now: How can I reduce my barriers of anxiety and shame and increase in the same time my ability to talk with girls about sex, sexuality and attraction?

Halo, you mentioned therapy (actually writing about it here on the forum is some kind of therapy as well) and a few books about sexuality. (Shade, Rose, Friday and so on) But what else can I do?

(03-30-2012 04:53 PM)YMZ Wrote:  [...] For example, whereas I used to allow that anxiety to mask itself as incompatibility with the girl, or to make me feel like I'm not attracted to the girl.[...]

Smile Oh man. Just realised that I did this for years and I was completely unaware of it. I always blamed it on AA and not sexual anxiety. Seems to be so that I missed quite a few dates and calls, that would have let to dates, because of my masked sexual anxiety...Hell, I'm actually doing this right now. (Should call a girl for a date and am actually avoiding it by writing this post.

****** up.
05-04-2012 03:32 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
YMZ Offline
Primordial Ooze
*

Posts: 21
Likes Given: 14
Likes Received: 7 in 4 posts
Joined: Feb 2012
Post: #18
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Edmond,

I think the concept of progressive desensitization can apply here. While I still have a long way to go in completely owning my anxieties, some small steps, whether conscious or not, have helped me become more open about sexuality in general.

- compliment women about their looks/outfit

Not too bad, and can be just a passing comment. You make both of your days a little brighter, and you end up addressing physicality and something that you find sexually pleasing.

- asking friends about their dating lives

You can start by asking for good date restaurants or activities and, from there, ask about how dates went, preferences on the opposite sex, etc etc. Since I began working on getting better with women, this topic comes up a fair bit by itself. In any case, it should be a rather natural conversation from adults. This should be a nice way to start talking about attraction.

- just throw the word "sexuality" around in conversations

Get comfortable with the idea of discussing sexuality. You're not actually saying anything, but just breaching the subject is good enough.

- reframe your conversations about sexuality

Sharing parts of your sexual past directly can be really intimidating, but can you spin these stories into less serious anecdotes? Next time someone asks you how a date went, can you say off-hand say something like "it was good, she's sweet, but for whatever reason I feel asexual toward her. I don't even know why"? It's not exactly a soul-baring confession. Can you spin the story of your bumbling first kiss into a cute self-depreciating story? Or how about throwing in some sexual innuendos into conversations? Hopefully it's more sophisticated than "that's what she said", but even then you're opening up yourself to showing others that you think sexually and are comfortable with that.

This last bit has been especially important. I can't remember where I heard this, so I'm paraphrasing here: shame evaporates when vulnerability (on your part) is met with empathy (from others). As long as you can keep taking these small steps in vulnerability, your anxieties should decrease gradually as you see that these thoughts are not deep dark secrets to hide in the closet behind all the skeletons.

An update on my situation, for all the good folks in here who took the time to help out with their input:

I've made some considerable progress since making my original post. One specific thing that's helped me a ton is actually admitting to girls that I'm nervous about sex. Is it what Daniel Rose recommends to develop dominance? Of course not. Is it true, and does it help me stop pretending to be a sex god? Absolutely. The girls don't mind, the sex is not great, but I'm okay with that and no longer have any unrealistic expectations about my performances. (I am, of course, trying to address the subpar emotional connections that come with the subpar sex).

The more I think through my problems with sexual anxiety, the more I see intimacy issues as a big contributor. In reading through some articles from The Rawness and Mark's "Attachment Theory" article, I realize that I'm pretty avoidant in most of my interactions that truly matter - likely because intimacy would be allowing someone else the opportunity to hurt me. Sex, then, is the deepest and most intimate arena where a girl (often a random) is able to subvert my masculine ego. For me, sexual performance has been so deeply linked to masculinity that it's no wonder I procrastinate on sex and tense up when time comes to address that false masculine ego.

Strangely, just becoming more aware of the source of the anxiety has made me feel a lot more comfortable with where I currently stand. I still have thoughts about performance dancing in the back of my head, but they are not so crippling as soon as I identified the anxiety as a defense mechanism, just like most anxieties are.

Thanks again everyone.

The articles I'm talking about:

http://postmasculine.com/attachment-theory

For Edmond, I think this series on The Rawness will be beneficial for you if you havn't seen it yet - particular the third and last part that addresses the negative emotional triggers that prevent us from taking action.

http://therawness.com/limitations-of-knowledge-series/
05-05-2012 12:03 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Halo Effect Offline
Love/Belonging
****

Posts: 597
Likes Given: 174
Likes Received: 314 in 152 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #19
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Quote:I've made some considerable progress since making my original post. One specific thing that's helped me a ton is actually admitting to girls that I'm nervous about sex. Is it what Daniel Rose recommends to develop dominance? Of course not. Is it true, and does it help me stop pretending to be a sex god? Absolutely. The girls don't mind, the sex is not great, but I'm okay with that and no longer have any unrealistic expectations about my performances. (I am, of course, trying to address the subpar emotional connections that come with the subpar sex).

YMZ, it's excellent that you share that with them! You're being real, and you're being vulnerable. By doing this, you will be able to behave like Daniel Rose prescribes soon enough! You don't get there by acting, you get there by growing as a man. And by sharing this, you can actually increase the emotional connection. Sex is to a large degree emotional and mental, especially for women. She may have deeper, more fulfilling sex with you when you're open with her, than with some macho who fucks her hard without looking her in the eyes.


Quote:I just realised that I've got the same problem. But in my case I never really talked much about sex, because of my inexperience. You know, the major belief behind it is that I'm afraid of others finding out that I'm inexperienced with girls and sex in general and that I'll be negatively judged for it and loose my reputation. This is an effect of me opening up about this topic a few years ago. Told some former friends about it and they let my whole school know it and since then I don't like to talk about that topic anymore.

Your post made me remember something. I always say I've always been very honest. Well, not always, I just remembered. One time while I was in Australia, and still a virgin, we played the "Never have I ever..." game. The game is basically someone saying "Never have I ever [whatever sexual activity]" and then you have to take a sip from your drink if you have done that activity. I was very anxious and there was no way I would admit I was so inexperienced. So sometimes I would just take a sip. I happened to take a sip when a guy said "Never have I ever come on a girl's face" and after I took a sip he was surprised and a little shocked... I thought "WHAT? They do that all the time in porn. There's something wrong with that? :O". I was very embarassed. But I totally forgot I was dishonest just to cover up my shame of being inexperienced! I have come a long way in being vulnerable...

Edmond, once I got a little sexual experience, this fear of talking about sex disappeared to a large extent. It was almost like I thought: finally, I can talk about sex, because I've had it! So this, combined with my honesty and open-mindedness, made me into a guy that discusses things pretty easily.

Quote:This negative experiences give me a hard to open up myself sexually, both verbal and physically, to girls. I'm asexual around them and this really frustrates me.
Oh, I know that feeling. I was asexual around girls for a long time. It is still somewhat of a sticking point for me now. In situations where the girl shows interest in me, or it is an environment like a bar or club, or it is in the context of a relationship, then I'm extremely open and forward. However, in the context of a study group or at work, I was often still the nice guy. This annoyed the hell out of me. Note that I don't want to be a dirty man who talks about sex all the time. I'm talking about being a masculine man who exudes sexual confidence. I've improved at this in the last few months, and much of it is due to gradually pushing my comfort zone again.

Quote:Halo, you mentioned therapy (actually writing about it here on the forum is some kind of therapy as well) and a few books about sexuality. (Shade, Rose, Friday and so on) But what else can I do?

This process will be unique for every man. But I'd say you can focus on two things: 1) reducing shame, 2) gaining sexual confidence.

Shame is the big culprit here. Shame is that feeling that you are somehow bad or rotten on the inside, and that if you show your true self to her, she will reject it. The less shame you have, the more open you can be. And the more open you can be, the less shame you have. Shame depends on secrecy and isolation to exist. If you let light in, the darkness goes away! Or was it ever there in the first place? Smile You do have to find people who you can share safely with. Therapy is awesome because you can share everything for the first time and you know they won't tell anyone else. But I promise you: girls are generally very cool about this. I've told girls the wildest things and asked them to do dirty stuff, and they still like me! Some even like me more because I am like that! And sharing deep things can create an emotional connection and can even make a girl feel special, because you opened up to her.

Here's an exercise to try for you right now: Say out loud to yourself (when you're alone) "I love women", "I love sex", "I want sex", "I want to fuck a girl". Does that feel weird for you, or can you feel completely congruent while saying it? Be aware of what you feel. Even though it is obvious that you want this, saying it out loud might show that you don't stand fully behind it. And what if you do the same for the things that really turn you on? "I want to dominate a girl and fuck her roughly", "I want her to do everything I tell her to do", "I want to fuck a girl in the ass" (your preferences may be different, just say the explicit things you want to do). Can you say that and feel strong and congruent? If yes, that's great. If not, try to become aware of the thoughts and feelings that resist identifying with those statements. Those statements are the expression of your true sexuality. They are a part of you, they are who you are. If something is stopping you from identifying with them, find out what it is and see if you can overcome it. In the end, you want to be able to say this kind of things confidently while looking your girl in the eyes!

What was also extremely beneficial in my development was having regular sex. It sucks to give advice to a guy who has a hard time being sexual and who doesn't have much sex, that he should have sex to overcome that problem. But that's the way it is. The best thing would be to see a girl regularly who you can be honest with. Girls can be really awesome, don't underestimate how accepting some girls are! Once you have regular sex, you have the perfect outlet to constantly battle these shame issues head on. The reading and therapy and so on will help you to get the most out of it, but in the end, you want to be able to actually express yourself sexually, and you do that in the bedroom. You want to be able to let out your desire, your lust, your masculine sexuality, with a real woman. And again, baby steps are fine. Push yourself a little each time.

You know where you want to go. You have your goal in mind. As long as you act with that goal in the back of your mind, you will keep gravitating towards that goal.


Sexual confidence is a different matter, although it's very intertwined with sexual shame. It is possible to be good at sex while still having much sexual shame, but being sexually confident definitely makes you more comfortable at sex, sexually escalation and with talking about sex. And reducing shame will make it much easier to be good in bed.

If a girl tells you "That was amazing!" or even "You're the best I've ever had", that does something to you!

Feeling confident about sex makes it easier for me to talk about sex, too. I also have read a lot about sexuality, attraction, masculinity and femininity, fantasies, etc. So I also feel confident in my knowledge about sex, and this further helps me to have deep conversations about sex. You get good at sex by practicing, while applying the reading material that has been discussed here before (e.g. Shade, Rose). Oh, and don't worry. The average man doesn't push himself to become better and doesn't read about sex. The average man is not very good in bed. It's easy to become better than average!

Borrowing from psychological theory, self-effiacy (the belief in your competence at an activity) can be increased in several ways: (source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-efficacy )
Quote:Factors affecting self-efficacy
Bandura points to four sources affecting self-efficacy;
1. Experience - a.k.a. Enactive Attainment
"Mastery experience" is the most important factor deciding a person's self-efficacy. Simply put, success raises self-efficacy, failure lowers it.
"Children cannot be fooled by empty praise and condescending encouragement. They may have to accept artificial bolstering of their self-esteem in lieu of something better, but what I call their accruing ego identity gains real strength only from wholehearted and consistent recognition of real accomplishment, that is, achievement that has meaning in their culture." (Erik Erikson)
2. Modeling - a.k.a. "Vicarious Experience"
“If they can do it, I can do it as well.” This is a process of comparison between oneself and someone else. When people see someone succeeding at something, their self-efficacy will increase; and where they see people failing, their self-efficacy will decrease. This process is more effectual when a person sees him- or herself as similar to his or her own model. If a peer who is perceived as having similar ability succeeds, this will usually increase an observer's self-efficacy. Although not as influential as experience, modeling is a powerful influence when a person is particularly unsure of him- or herself.
3. Social Persuasions
Social persuasions relate to encouragements/discouragements. These can have a strong influence – most people remember times where something said to them significantly altered their confidence. While positive persuasions increase self-efficacy, negative persuasions decrease it. It is generally easier to decrease someone's self-efficacy than it is to increase it.
4. Physiological Factors
In unusual, stressful situations, people commonly exhibit signs of distress; shakes, aches and pains, fatigue, fear, nausea, etc. A person's perceptions of these responses can markedly alter a person's self-efficacy. If a person gets 'butterflies in the stomach' before public speaking, those with low self-efficacy may take this as a sign of their own inability, thus decreasing their self-efficacy further, while those with high self-efficacy are likely to interpret such physiological signs as normal and unrelated to his or her actual ability. Thus, it is the person's belief in the implications of their physiological response that alters their self-efficacy, rather than the sheer power of the response.

As you can see, success experiences is the most important and most powerful means through which you start to feel more confident at something. Number 2 and 3 you can take care of here and in your reading and possibly therapy. They will help in themselves making you feel more confident and comfortable with sex, and they will help you get the sucess experiences, too. This is not a clear, linear process. Everything affects everything. But if you stay on this road, you will look back in a year and see how much you have improved.
(This post was last modified: 05-05-2012 09:05 PM by Halo Effect.)
05-05-2012 08:48 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
The following 3 users Like Halo Effect's post:
Edmond Dantès (06-20-2012), Guyintheback (05-06-2012), Salaam (06-21-2012)
Guyintheback Offline
Safety
***

Posts: 154
Likes Given: 95
Likes Received: 16 in 12 posts
Joined: Oct 2011
Post: #20
RE: Sexual Anxiety
Wow, thanks for that post Halo Effect!
05-06-2012 07:48 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
  Sexual Anxiety and my Response Darshinator82 6 334 04-18-2013 03:08 PM
Last Post: Darshinator82
  Need book recommendation for sexual confidence Vlad 7 374 03-06-2013 12:10 AM
Last Post: TheImptuous
  College, Approach Anxiety, Porn, and Bad Boy Image saxman92 40 2,022 02-08-2013 11:35 PM
Last Post: saxman92
  Sexual Shame? "Fuck it, we'll see how it goes" Tim 2 581 11-24-2012 12:43 PM
Last Post: Edmond Dantès
  Exercise 2 of the Sexual Confidence Program Ryan 3 479 10-05-2012 12:40 PM
Last Post: Scott
  Sexual Confidence While Discovering Female Body ? mikemintz 5 830 08-27-2012 05:18 PM
Last Post: CHB2
  Does fighting anxiety translate to becoming a better person? Spikes 1 525 06-02-2012 05:16 AM
Last Post: Spikes
  Practical Exercises to Reduce Neediness, Social Anxiety and Raise Self-Esteem inthemiddle 2 1,056 05-28-2012 12:48 AM
Last Post: CHB2
  When should you handle social anxiety and when should you embrace it? compass 2 434 02-29-2012 02:58 PM
Last Post: Jon
  A Crave Sexual Validation From Women - Constantly. Help. LucidDayDream 5 1,009 02-26-2012 08:04 PM
Last Post: Edmond Dantès

Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)