Question: Programs

[Heisenberg]

To Mark/ Anyone who can answer:

I'm confused about what your products do, and which would be best for me, considering my goals.
*Find awesome girls I connect with and meet my emotional needs.
*Meet enough to filter out ones that will drive me crazy. (Avoidant Connection types... they hurt too much to get involved with.)
*Work myself towards more secure-attachment type.

Right now my approach is just ok, but If a girl is into me and I'm into her, I can escalate and keep things fairly interesting... although my relationship management still needs a ton of work.
I've only really gotten girls who were captive audiences though (school/social circle)... haven't done much outside of those.

I have read models front to back once, and went over the first few chapters again earlier this year... but I'm interested in the structured, action-based regimen. Help me stay disciplined and consistent.


Lifestyle:
*In school
*Started Lifting Weights about a month ago
*Fair amount of free time for next few quarters (classes not difficult yet).
*Getting over an avoidant girl who I've been tearing myself up over for about 3 weeks.
*Not obsessed with becoming a ladies man, just want that area of my life handled so I can focus on other things.

I appreciate all responses, thanks.

[Mark]

It sounds like you could probably get something out of both of them, although it really depends on your goals at the moment:

Think of it this way:
- If you want to increase the quantity of your interactions, go with the approach program.
- If you want to increase the quality of your interactions, go with the connection program.

Whichever you think is the biggest problem right now, start there. Chances are, if you're already meeting women, but it's not going very far, connection program is going to benefit you more.

[Warped Mindless]

Mark, when is the "Attraction Program" coming out?

[Mark]

I'm not sure. I've put it on hold and am considering not releasing it for a few reasons:

1) Of the three programs, I'm the least satisfied with the content for the Attraction Program.
2) Of the three programs, I think the Attraction Program has most of it's material covered in Models, it's just a matter of doing it.
3) Of the three programs, this one's generating the least amount of interest/excitement. You're literally the second person to ask me about it. Whereas people were asking me about the approach and connection programs weekly for months on end.
4) This year, I'm going to start steering the business away from being solely a dating advice business and address other areas of life and self development in general.

This is what I'm thinking at the moment, and I'd love to hear feedback from you or anyone else who cares. The Attract Program was three sections: humor/teasing, leading/being assertive, escalation/getting sexual.

The teasing and humor stuff is good, but I've come to believe that it's overrated and not as important as most guys think it is. The leading stuff is useful I suppose. The escalation stuff comes down to conquering sexual anxiety, which all in all, I think is by far the biggest problem guys have with women who may be interested in them. So I may take the second and third parts of the program and reorient them towards a product on sexual anxiety in the future.

Or, if enough people bother me, I may finish the program up and put it out, but whereas I was pretty excited about the first two, this one I'm having trouble getting excited about.

[Warped Mindless]

I think you should release it for the sake of completeness.

I do happen to agree with you about the teasing and humor being overrated and stuff however I think people need to put a stronger emphasis on sexual escalation.

[Heisenberg]

I say if you don't believe in it completely, don't release it.

Models def lays it out clearly.

I'd rather see something dealing with social skill in general, emotions, or a lifestyle program!!!
... seems like that's the direction you're heading.

~
Quick question: Does the attraction program handle finding where to meet girls?

[Mark]

No, I imagine finding where women are is something every guy can do on their own.

I'm pretty torn on releasing it. It makes a lot of sense from a business sense to put it out there... but I think if I do I need to go back and rework the content and make it a bit different/something more than it is right now. As is, I'm not comfortable releasing it... yet, it's kind of stupid to not release it... so I guess that answer's my question.

I'm planning on writing another book this summer and I'm super fucking excited for it, so not being excited about the Attraction Program yet needing to put 2-4 weeks worth of work into it is kind of frustrating.

We'll see... I'll let you guys know soon.

[tough017]

If I remember well the results of a survey you did in Practicalpickup, a fair number of people requested a program centered on attraction and sexual escalation (as much as for the approach program for example). So it would be a shame that one of the biggest “sticking points” of your readers was not covered by a program. Like Warped Mindless said you should release it for the sake of completeness.

Quote:2) Of the three programs, I think the Attraction Program has most of it's material covered in Models,..

In Models you covered what you call “passive attraction” mostly, but the book skim trough “active attraction” I think.

Quote:...it's just a matter of doing it.

The same as the approach thing, that’s just a matter of doing it, but you did a program about this subject anyway. So…

If you have some problems getting motivated…I don’t know, maybe take a little more time for this one.

[Mark]

Yeah, it may be another month or two. But it seems not releasing it would be dumb... I'll figure something out.

[Swimmer]

Don't underestimate "leading/being assertive".

If you don't know where you are going (leading) and don't set clear boundaries (assertive), you're dead in the water.

(05-03-2012 01:38 PM)tough017 Wrote:  If I remember well the results of a survey you did in Practicalpickup, a fair number of people requested a program centered on attraction and sexual escalation (as much as for the approach program for example). So it would be a shame that one of the biggest “sticking points” of your readers was not covered by a program. Like Warped Mindless said you should release it for the sake of completeness.

Quote:2) Of the three programs, I think the Attraction Program has most of it's material covered in Models,..

In Models you covered what you call “passive attraction” mostly, but the book skim trough “active attraction” I think.

Quote:...it's just a matter of doing it.

The same as the approach thing, that’s just a matter of doing it, but you did a program about this subject anyway. So…

If you have some problems getting motivated…I don’t know, maybe take a little more time for this one.

A lot of people don't really understand "principles" and how to practically apply them in their lifes, but need structured progressive exercises to follow in order to make progress.

My suggestion is to release it, based on the model you followed with the Attraction and Connection Programs. I'm positively sure you'll find a way.

[Mark]

Yeah, I'm going to finish it and release it... hopefully have it out by the end of May.

Thanks guys.

[Kurt]

Hey, I'm wondering whether this program will continue the emphasis on desensitization. Before I discovered your material, I used desensitization and found I was able to approach women just fine. But I hit a sticking point with taking conversational risks. Personally, I found it harder to think of ways to use desensitization for that. Most attractive behaviors involve taking these risks.

I realize that feeling obliged to tell a joke is needy, but feeling unable to say something funny if it occurs to me naturally is still a problem I have with women I don't know well. Some people tell me they're very surprised I have a good sense of humor after they get to know me.

Another point: to me, not all challenging or "vulnerable" behaviors are attractive. For example, disagreeing with a hot woman is not usually thought of as "attraction", but it's still a sticking point for guys. (Maybe this is covered in your connection product.) I think what's tough is not "attraction", but rather expressing yourself more freely, with less concern about what she thinks. Sometimes this will involve obviously attractive behaviors like teasing, joking, being playful, or leading, but I wonder if guys would also benefit from saying things that will only make them come across as less attractive, such disagreeing, or admitting they have nothing to say -- just to get over the sense that there is something terrible about revealing their imperfections and having a woman (perhaps) not approve.

Just my two cents.

[Mark]

(05-21-2012 01:04 AM)Kurt Wrote:  Hey, I'm wondering whether this program will continue the emphasis on desensitization. Before I discovered your material, I used desensitization and found I was able to approach women just fine. But I hit a sticking point with taking conversational risks. Personally, I found it harder to think of ways to use desensitization for that. Most attractive behaviors involve taking these risks.

Yes, desensitization and repetition of habits.

Quote:Another point: to me, not all challenging or "vulnerable" behaviors are attractive. For example, disagreeing with a hot woman is not usually thought of as "attraction", but it's still a sticking point for guys. (Maybe this is covered in your connection product.) I think what's tough is not "attraction", but rather expressing yourself more freely, with less concern about what she thinks. Sometimes this will involve obviously attractive behaviors like teasing, joking, being playful, or leading, but I wonder if guys would also benefit from saying things that will only make them come across as less attractive, such disagreeing, or admitting they have nothing to say -- just to get over the sense that there is something terrible about revealing their imperfections and having a woman (perhaps) not approve.

Just my two cents.

Disagreeing with women can, and often is, attractive. Attraction is not necessarily a warm fuzzy feeling. Attraction often occurs with anger or frustration or confusion. You seem to be stuck in the "Nice Guy" mindset of believing that if you offend anyone or hurt anyone's feelings then they'll never like you. This is a false mindset and actually a weak mindset. In fact, it's the willingness to risk offending or hurting someone which often makes you bold and attractive.

[Thor]

Mark any news on the attraction program ?

Cheers..

[Mark]

The program itself is done.. working on the marketing. Hoping to launch it next week.

[Thor]

Thanks for the update I am looking foreward to it.

(06-12-2012 06:25 PM)Mark Wrote:  The program itself is done.. working on the marketing. Hoping to launch it next week.

[I_Dare]

@Mark - why do you think teasing/humor is overrated? Do you think being boring has the same impact as being fun/engaging/teasing? Teasing shows you're not really intimidated by her and being fun/humor shows intelligence and some personal content. It's also a fun way to spend time with girls. Why are these unimportant?

[Tim]

Not teasing ≠ being boring! In fact often quite the opposite. Teasing is a fun way to build shallow rapport; you're both saying you like each other and you're enjoying playing a game. But you can tease pretty much anyone with ease and it doesn't tell you much about them. Actually talking about yourselves, sharing opinions on topics of real interest, etc is (usually) much more powerful. You're communicating your identity; who you really are. And that's what girls will be deeply attracted to.

Even a guy who only flirts with and teases a girl is attracting her through his identity. He might think it's just because of that, but there's always something deeper happening at the same time. If a girl is willing to sleep with a guy who only teases and jokes, then it's likely because she wants to sleep with a guy who keeps things at that level. Either because she just prefers sex that way, or because she has a fear of guys who try and get deeper- for whatever reason. In this scenario, the guy is sub communicating 'I'm the kind of guy who only flirts and teases girls. I don't go deeper' and if that's what she wants, she'll be attracted. But don't be mistaken in thinking his jokes and teasing are solely what attracted her to him. It's what they say about him that attracted her more.

Guys assume that flirting and teasing get them a long way because it's exciting and you feel the challenge while still bonding. This is a mistake I used to make a lot. But in fact it's a very shallow bond compared to sharing your real identities, much of which has little need for humour/teasing. That's why Mark said it's overrated.

[Mark]

If teasing is the only way you know how to not be boring then you're doing it wrong.

[Chaos]

I know this sounds a little silly but in fact I'd go against teasing unless you know what you're doing. I used to tease too much, and yeah, it got me a lot of attraction but it also painted me as superficial. After a couple of times where I girl would tell me she thought I was shallow ironically when she discovered I wasn't (after some deep conversation about any given topic), I discovered I was giving out the wrong impression and I don't know how many girls may have left thinking I was really, really superficial.

Nowadays I'm able to mix teasing with standard humor with deep conversations although I still tease too much. But if you're just teasing, you may attract (I certainly did) but I can assure you you're not connecting at all.

[Mark]

Teasing can be fun in short bursts, but a lot of guys over-compensate with it or even use it as a defense mechanism to prevent things from becoming too intimate or personal. Learning to tease well can give you some short-term improvements in results, but in the long-run I don't think it's that important.

Honestly, if you told me I could never tease again, I don't think my results would suffer at all.

[Mark]

The program is up:

http://postmasculine.com/sexual

[Thor]

Excellent Mark I have just registered. Really looking foreward to beginning lesson 1 this evening.