Just bought Models.

[Creatine Dreams]

40 pages in so far and I am liking it.

A man needs hope. But more importantly, a man needs a plan.

[Zac]

It's a great book. I read quotes to my gf the entire time I was reading it and she couldn't stop raving about it.

[Creatine Dreams]

Yeah, I like it so far. One of the painful things I have experienced while reading the book is realizing that my problems with women are because of me.

Lately, I have gotten in the habit of trying to find reasons to blame this girl I was seeing for dumping me. I tried to create all kinds of personality flaws that she had in my mind.

Granted, she was not a perfect person, but in hindsight, she was a pretty cool girl. But I fucked it up and that is not a pleasant realization to have. I was simply too needy.

The pattern was simply this. Low investment by me, high investment by her --> Higher investment by me, lower investment by her + my obsession with sex = She leaves me.

I wish I had read this book before I started dating her, but ultimately I think I need to go through the experience of rejection in order to deal with it better in the future.

There will be other women in my life and when I do meet one who I really like, I will hopefully be a better man. I think that this book will help me become that better man.

[Tim]

Creatine Dreams that's great that you're starting to look at yourself and see how you can be responsible for creating the nature of the relationship. Keep it up man!

[The Notorious PhD]

Creatine -

I applaud your wanting to improve yourself and be a better man. But I sensed something about your mindset, that I want to caution you on (btw, it's entirely possible that I misread something, caveat emptor):

You must want to be a better man for your own sake and not because girls will like it. Assuredly, after your journey of improvement, girls certainly will like you. But their validation must not fuel this progress; it cannot be the motivating reason.

Why?

Because even if you became an enormously attractive guy (well-traveled, well-built, well-versed...well-hung ), at some point(s) someone you like will not like you back. That's the practical reality. And if your reason was their approval, it doesn't matter if you end-up becoming President of the world; them not liking you, will still get you down.

On the other hand, if you undertake all this self-improvement so that you can look in the mirror and be proud of who you are, then no matter what another person thinks, you'll know deep down that all you need to be happy is yourself. You will personify non-neediness. You will still get rejected (maybe a lot less), but the crucial difference will be that it won't affect your happiness or sense of self-worth.

[Mark]

Quote:Yeah, I like it so far. One of the painful things I have experienced while reading the book is realizing that my problems with women are because of me.

This is great.

[Creatine Dreams]

(05-20-2012 06:48 PM)The Notorious PhD Wrote:  Creatine -

I applaud your wanting to improve yourself and be a better man. But I sensed something about your mindset, that I want to caution you on (btw, it's entirely possible that I misread something, caveat emptor):

You must want to be a better man for your own sake and not because girls will like it. Assuredly, after your journey of improvement, girls certainly will like you. But their validation must not fuel this progress; it cannot be the motivating reason.

Why?

Because even if you became an enormously attractive guy (well-traveled, well-built, well-versed...well-hung ), at some point(s) someone you like will not like you back. That's the practical reality. And if your reason was their approval, it doesn't matter if you end-up becoming President of the world; them not liking you, will still get you down.

On the other hand, if you undertake all this self-improvement so that you can look in the mirror and be proud of who you are, then no matter what another person thinks, you'll know deep down that all you need to be happy is yourself. You will personify non-neediness. You will still get rejected (maybe a lot less), but the crucial difference will be that it won't affect your happiness or sense of self-worth.

I think you are half right, Notorious PhD.

On one hand, I want girls to like me. Not every girl, but the ones that I will like back. And I know that in order to get to that place where I am having great relationships with awesome women, I need to improve myself. So yes, part of my motivation for improving myself is so that women that I find desirable will like me.

On the other hand, I realized from my last (and only) relationship that a woman that you like spending time with is not a panacea for all of your problems. In fact, it causes new problems. While I was dating her, I was constantly worried that she would discover the real me and not like that person. But the problem was that I did not like who I was and where I was going. It had a lot more to do with me than with her. I valued her attention and validation way too much. While it was nice to have a girl who would send you nice texts and show affection, I could not fully enjoy that in a healthy way because I was terrified of losing her. And eventually, I did. And when I did lose her, I felt way worse than I did before I met her. I experienced a real connection with a woman for the first time and losing that was rough. I am not sure if the way I feel about how things went down is healthy, but I do think it is necessary for me to experience the pain and grow as a person.

But the experience taught me a lot. It taught me that I need to more focused on what I want out of life. It taught me that having a woman in your life is a nice thing but that if you are not happy with yourself, the relationship will not go anywhere. It taught me about what I actually like in a woman. But most importantly, it taught me that I should never base my happiness on the approval of a woman.

So yeah, I am working on myself so that I can have better relations with women in my life, but most importantly, I am working on myself so that I can become a person who likes who he is and can generate happiness and health from within.

---

BTW, I am on page 157.

[Creatine Dreams]

Just finished the book. It was a great read.

Now, I gotta read it again, do the exercises and really internalize everything.

[baller08]

Creatine Dreams - even in the short 3 months I've been posting with you, I've seen a huge shift. You're pushing through your pain period (which a lot of men fail to do), you're not taking any short cuts, and you're learning a lot. But you're also applying it and taking action.

In this thread here I talked about the 3 areas that most men don't balance well but you're doing that. Keep on the path that you're on, you're really doing great.