I have major trust issues

[Kunio]

I've come to the conclusion that my experiences in the dating game have damaged me and I need to reach out for help here. I'll try to keep it short:

I loved this girl. She was an admitted whore and yes, I recognize that I was an idiot for going after her that much. I had sex with her and she told me that she would get attached to me if I did so and want to be with me. That was a lie. It wasn't even the first one she told me. She gave me the whole, "I'm busy" bullshit excuse a few times after she promised me sex. I had broken through that basically by just calling her out on her lies, but she ended up moving across a few states to be with another guy in the end.

The other girl I loved was a virgin (spoiler alert: I didn't take it ). She was really shy, intelligent, cute. I went on a bunch of dates with her and I made it official that we were boyfriend and girlfriend by asking her and she said yes. I know from reading Mark's stuff that it's a mistake to skip the sex part, but I digress... It was a damn shame that when I finally got a chance to stay at her dorm, which was 3 hours away (she was close to me and off school when we met), she was sick. Now that wasn't a bullshit excuse, she really was sick, I talked to her. But by the time the next opportunity rolled around, someone else from college had asked her out, and she ditched me for him. She was honest about it, so I tried to stay in contact. When she broke up with this guy, I tried to hang out with her again. This is when she started lying to me and saying that she wanted to hang out, but was busy. She eventually stopped responding to my messages. Keep in mind that I wasn't texting her every few hours, just every couple of days at most (usually not even that). I have since cut all contact with both of the above chicks.

These experiences have made it very difficult to trust that a girl actually likes me and is not just lying to me and manipulating me into liking her when she doesn't really care about me. Now, I've tried my best to squash all neediness and expectations. But should I squash the need and expectation of honesty? Am I putting a girl up on a pedestal if I think that she's a good person that doesn't lie and bullshit people? There is this girl I went on a date with now who texts me a decent amount, and a lot of them are unsolicited. But I really can't shake the feeling that there's always that creeping possibility that she isn't being genuine. The worst part is that I have chastised girls for having trust issues that make them impossible to accept love, and yet here I am, having these same issues. I also realize that I may be exaggerating the severity of the dishonesty of the girls I've dated because of the ways that they've hurt me. But I needed to get this off my chest.

The only solution I've come up with is to just have faith that a girl that acts like she likes me is being genuine. Any help here to come up with ways to combat the negative emotions and mistrust would be appreciated.

[Mark]

It seems abundantly clear to me that these interactions are the symptom of deeper emotional problems, not the cause of your emotional problems.

Quote:But should I squash the need and expectation of honesty? Am I putting a girl up on a pedestal if I think that she's a good person that doesn't lie and bullshit people?

No you shouldn't. And no you're not. Honesty is a standard you should have for everyone in your life.

Reading between the lines here, my guess is your behavior was incredibly needy and unattractive, which eventually drove these girls away from you.

[Jon]

It sounds like you are ignoring non-verbal signals that girls are giving you. When a girl says she wants to see you but acts like she doesn't, she doesn't. You should take a hint. When a girl ACTS like she wants to see you, she does.

[Brian]

Jon Wrote:It sounds like you are ignoring non-verbal signals that girls are giving you. When a girl says she wants to see you but acts like she doesn't, she doesn't. You should take a hint. When a girl ACTS like she wants to see you, she does.

Most guys would ask, if she say she wants to see you but act like she doesnt, then why does she even say that.

It's because validation. She doesnt actually wants you, but she still enjoy seeing you want her lol. Perfect examples would be fat girls. I dont want to bang any fat girls, but i still enjoy flirting with them.

[Mark]

That and most of us are really bad at hurting other's feelings to their face. Most of us would rather reject someone from a distance than to do it up front.

[Leo]

Kunio, how old are these girls? Usually women in their late 20s early 30s don't hide their emotions, don't play games and communicate better than young girls. Are they americans?
I'd say that even if you have had sex with a girl you don't owe her anything and vice versa. I know you talked to them, but I'm just saying. I was having sex regularly with a woman few months ago and she used to call me: my friend. Nobody talked about commitment or anything even though we had sex regularly.
I recommend you to take it easy in the beginning, see how everything evolves and see if she's interested in you as well. You don't have necessarily to talk about it, let it happen, eventually somebody is gonna stick out the neck and make himself (herself) vulnerable. When you see that getting girls is not so hard like it seems you are not gonna be so desperate to get into a relationship, you get into a relationship if the girl is a good match for you in different areas of life.
And yeah, people need to be mature to reject you in your face or directly. Usually girls drop hints and they know we are not interested if we don't call anymore but I prefer to talk to her if I see she's expecting something more from me and I'm not interested.

[Kunio]

I'll be the first to admit not being perfect and slipping into the realm of the needy every now and again. All I want to do is be able to trust someone to be honest with me if they don't find me attractive and don't wanna pursue anything with me. Plenty of women have and I take the clear rejection as a gift that keeps me from wasting my time, as Mark says. When I find someone that seems to find me very attractive and fun to be with and makes an effort to be with me all the time, I don't want to take all the time and effort to build something with them only to find out that they're just gonna lie to me and I'm gonna have to cut off all contact with them. I want to find good honest positive people who I can remain on good terms with even if there isn't any attraction and be able to trust that they'll make this lack of attraction clear and not lie to me. You've mentioned the way to avoid dishonesty and game playing is to be open and honest about your intentions from the get-go. I'll have to take it on faith that these women turning out to be dishonest despite me being honest about what I was doing was just a rare occurrence. Maybe the revelations that I learned from your book about how my neediness was screwing things up will help me be more honest...

The first girl was 23 at the time, the second was 20. The girl I went out on a date with now is 29. And I'm 27, btw. They're all Americans. Nah, I think that if you're looking for a relationship and you see her as good relationship material, you should make that clear. That way, you don't waste a shitload of your time if she just wants to screw around. Nothing wrong with continuing to screw around if you're cool with that, though! As long as you aren't needy, you probably won't latch onto anyone too quickly, anyway. And you won't be crushed if they decline. Er, I wouldn't advise people to go out and bang other girls to bolster their self esteem, though. Firstly, that was the reason I went back to the first girl after the second girl dumped me and paid for it. Secondly, when I was making out with some chicks on the dance floor, all I could think about is how much my ex was better at it. The point is that your self esteem should come from within, so that no one can question it.

[Leo]

I feel your pain, but getting hurt is pretty common in relationships. Think about Tiger Wood's wife, Sandra Bullock, etc. And these are women that were MARRIED with these guys and were publicly embarrased. Married women betray too, just in case. My ex-roommate is in the closet, he doesn't admit his homosexuality, and he has a woman (mother of his child) in his country waiting for him to get married with her. I think she's gonna wait forever. I've met couples that have been married for years and suddenly one spouse says to the other: I'm gay, I can't keep living this lie. I'm talking about 20 years of marriage. I have gay friends that have sex with SUPPOSED heterosexual married guys, etc, etc, etc. So, you see; your case is not so bad you weren't married with these girls, you didn't have kids with them you just have to move on and life goes on. Some people stay traumatized for the rest of their lives but we have to take the risk and try. Just my 2 cents.

[Kunio]

As if we needed another reason not to get married on top of alimony rape! Haha, but thanks, that did help put things in perspective. If things DO turn out the way they did with these other chicks, at least that will mean that I didn't get far enough with them to have such regrets.