Dealing with your father

[Thor]

Looking back to my child hood. My father was extremely domineering. Dont get me wrong he was a very loving person and did everything to give us the best in life. Hes a very strong man having spent most of his earlier life in the navy.

Unfortunately what he preached wasnt always what I really wanted or what would prepare me for the real world.

He insisted I do well at school as a child as I was never as good as my younger brother academically. As a child I hated the pressure he put on me. Then he decided it was time I got married and organised me to go to India to get married. I was 25 years old then and I had never had a girlfriend or had a sexual experience. The day I was due to fly out to india to meet my future. On that day I packed my bags and ran away from home.

Years later I returned to my father and mother my father greeted me with open arms it was like we were closer together then when we were as a child.

There are days when I visit him hes always angry and upset with myself and brother for not being married and him not having grand children. He comes out with angry outbursts now and again telling me how the couple next door are happily married yet me and my brother are not married.

Even though hes old and frail I still feel he has an emotional grip over me over what I should and shouldnt be doing. What he has these outbursts I just keep quiet and never say a word.

I am passed the point of blaming him for what happened in the past. My question is how do I explain to him why I am doing what I am doing ?. He seems so stuck in his ways.

[Tobias]

Difficult question. I bet nobody on this forum including myself can address your problem properly. Thats because of the inherent psychological complexity. In other words, is it your problem if you have a bad relationship with your parents? If you are a nice guy, you will blame yourself for being a bad son. If your are not embarassed/not a nice guy, you must have had non-judgemenatal parents.

It's their responsibility to love you unconditionally and to foster a good relationship. No matter what. If they can't do that, it's not your fault. They failed as parents which means you have to take control of your life and relationships. By the way, I am not surprised that your father is domineering. After all, he's Odin.

[Thor]

Thanks for taking the time to reply Tobias. After posting this question I began reading a book called "no more mr nice guy" which has given me a clearer understanding to the whole relationship with my father. I will always love him as hes a good man. As you said I have to take control of my own life to get things sorted.

Thanks

[Creatine Dreams]

This is not an easy issue to deal with.

I harbored a lot of resentment to my father for various reasons.

1. I hated him because he was kind of effeminate and did not act like a strong male role model.
2. I hated him because he was over-controlling and I always had to do things his way.
3. I hated him because he never took an interest in my interests.
4. I hated him because he never took an interest in my friends.
5. I hated him because he never got me involved in sports.
6. I hated him because I felt he loved my sister more than me.
7. Later on, I hated him because I blamed him for my lack of success with women.

But eventually, I learned that I had to deal with it. And it was not easy. I admitted to him that I resented him and while it did not make everything ok, it definitely lifted a weight off my shoulders.

Eventually, I learned how to accept who he was. I realized that he was a different person than me, but that in many ways, we are actually very similar. We are both stubborn. We can both be prone to getting angry. And we both do not always like being told what to do.

So the best solution for me was to limit my contact with him. This is natural because I am a 34 year old male and I live on my own. But now, when I do see him, I try to focus on things that we can enjoy together. I try not to see him as the reason that I am not yet successful in life. I try and have fun with him and that is all I can do. If he acts grouchy, I ignore it and try not to overreact. If I act grouchy, I try to check myself and act more respectful. I cannot control the way he acts, but I can control the way I act. And that is really all you can do.

I went on a trip with him last year. He likes photography but he takes a ridiculous amount of time to take photos. So this often frustrated me because I like to see something and then move on. We fought at times, but overall, the trip was a success. Eventually, he realized that he does take a ridiculous amount of time to take picture and that he should consider my time. I also realized that I can be impatient and that I should consider his enjoyment of photography. Granted, it is a difficult balance but at least we both made an attempt.

One of the hardest things for me to do was to talk to him about how bummed I was about getting out of my first relationship. I was embarrassed because this was the first girl I ever dated and even though I hated to admit it, deep down, I had a deep seated insecurity about how my dad judged me. But I talked about it with him and I felt better.

It was and still is a stressful time for me. But he would call me and talk to me to see how I was doing. He would tell me stories about his past and how he dealt with women. These are things I never really heard about until I decided to open up and I am glad I did.

Granted, I still have a long way to go. I am still thinking about a girl who dumped me two months ago. I am still not sure if I like the career path that I am on. And I still do not know exactly what I want out of life. But admitting these things to my father has definitely helped to remove the shame that has held me back for so long.

I guess the point is this. People come and go. But your family will always be your family. While they may not always meet your expectations, I feel that it is best one to be open with them and for one to try and forgive them for whatever misgivings they had in raising you. It may not be perfect afterward, but at least you know that you did what you could. And I believe that will help remove a lot of shame.

[Thor]

Actually when I told my father how angry I was when he forced me into an arranged marriage he burst into tears and said he was so sorry he did that. Telling him this was a weight of my shoulder.

He could have been a strong role model for me if he had'nt been so controlling when I was a child. I did realize later on in life hes a very loving person.

A few years ago when we had a really bad winter. He rescued a dog all by himself that was stuck in the snow. Brought him into the house and began feeding him. When I asked him what made him risk his life to do that. He told me that he was afraid that dog might have get stuck in the snow and die. Hes shown other acts of kindness that make me think hes not the person I use to think he was.

[Creatine Dreams]

Yeah, I think the older you get, the more you realize that your parents are just people. For better or worse...

[Thor]

Exactly mate...

[SeXyBaCk]

Not only are they people, but they're also not going to change with age, just become less authoritarian and more like children.

I think you've taken the big step in telling your dad what he did to you and him understanding this I'm sure has done your relationship a world of good. What remains is for you to figure out how to have a relationship with him that works for both of you. If you still feel that underlying anger it's probably wisest to limit your contact, which in itself can be hard, he is your father after all. Another options is to seek professional council and try and work through all the emotions that might still remain under the surface.

The truth is we can't turn all our relationships into great ones. Sometimes you're just stuck with a less than great hand and you have to make the best of it. What's crucial is not to let your past interfere with your present or future.

[Salaam]

I feel like in order for our relationships to grow and evolve with our parents, there must come a point in time where they acknowledge and truly see you for the man/woman you are and not the boy or child they raised. We are our own people first and then your son/daughter. There needs to be that moment where they see that to be the case or else they won't change their behaviors.

I also have a very strong father, dominating even, who knew little of nurturing from his own father. I had to fight him to get him to see me. To get him to stop trying to control and dominate me. But through that conflict, we became closer, understood each other more, and I feel like I even nurture him now. The love is there, but it can be so much more fulfilling if respect and true regard share that same space as well.

[Tim]

(05-22-2012 09:10 PM)Salaam Wrote:  We are our own people first and then your son/daughter.

Nice.

[Thor]

I can totally relate to you on this level thankyou for sharing Salaam

(05-22-2012 09:10 PM)Salaam Wrote:  But through that conflict, we became closer, understood each other more, and I feel like I even nurture him now.

[Salaam]

My pleasure T.

[wavering_radiant]

Honestly, if there's any emotional issue that bothers me the most right now, it's this one. All I can do is either get really angry or sad anytime I think about my father. He's a very stubborn religious fanatic who has a hard time admitting he's wrong about anything. He was incredibly overbearing and strict, and I think that a lot of my anger issues can be traced back to my interactions with him.

One of the worst things that happened between me and him is when I told him that I am no longer a Christian, I told him that I still loved him, and this is exactly what he said to me "Son, I would rather that you hate me and believe in God than for you to love me and not believe in him." I feel like he chose his own religion over me. If he were put in the position of Abraham and was asked by God to kill me to show his devotion to God, I really think he would kill me. I can't seem to ever have a single conversation with him where he doesn't bring up the subject of religion. And whenever him and my mom would get into a huge fight (which was often), he would tell us that we were forbidden from telling anyone about anything that happened because he didn't want to damage his reputation in the church. He has all kinds of ridiculous rules about things like alcohol. For alcohol is pure evil, period, even a single drink (which is weird for a Christian since Jesus supposedly turned water into wine). Rock music is evil for him, and it seemed like every single band that I would try to listen to he somehow thought was evil. He taught me that seeking my own will was something bad, and that I should always try to do "God's will." So anytime I would try to talk with him about things I wanted to do with my life, his question was always "Well son, is that God's will?" Because apparently trying to do things my way the way I want to is something evil.

He's incredibly paranoid about sex. He refuses to watch anything on TV that mentions sex at all, because that is "perverted." He's extremely homophobic, anytime anything about a gay person is mentioned, he gets so angry and has to rant on about how terrible gay people are. When I was at home, anytime I would be watching a show like Seinfeld, anytime there would be a gay character on the show, he would get angry and insist on changing the channel. Him and my mom hardly ever showed any affection in front of me and my siblings, and I have a hard time understanding how they even stayed married until now, because it really doesn't seem like they even love each other.

I honestly don't think that I am ever going to have much of a relationship with my father. I talk to him a couple times a month on the phone, and that's about it. I think if he would just back down off his religious soap box, then things could get better, but I really don't see that happening. It's especially hard, because he's also extremely anti-evolution, but I want to be an evolutionary biologist, so I probably don't even have to spell out how difficult that is.

[Cosmo]

Son, I would rather that you hate me and believe in God than for you to love me and not believe in him."

I can really empathise with you. Your father should never, ever in a million years have uttered this statement. He's basically giving you a condition of worth (in his mind) that makes you worthless because your lack of belief in the big bearded dude in the sky. As a parent he has huge power over your psyche (which he does not deserve) and it is very, very important that he lets you know that unless you go on a massive rape-murder rampage you are never a "bad" or worthless" human being. You are in fact perfect and exist only to be loved and respected.

I can empathise with you because my father was very hard on me, one of my earliest memories is him slapping the shit out of me cause I was very noisy at the dentist and I also remember crying over my maths sums because he made me get them all perfect.

Ultimately its your place as a man know to tolerate (if not love) your father and try and understand that he doesn't really have a choice but be bigoted. Its a racket, or extremely deeply ingrained, ego protection behaviour. He's doing his best (although this is dreadful).

Its up to you to find new father figures like Mark, or David Deida or some strong (good man) in your live.

all the best,

Cameron

[IdEngager]

I'm proud to say that I have a very good relationship with my father. We had some rough patches growing up. At his worse, he could be overbearing and angry, I guess very stereotypical Asian father in that way. He never got angry to the point of violence (other than spanking when I was really little), but there were times I would be terrified of getting on his wrong side. He'd definitely be very hard on me at times, pointing out things I did wrong to the point where I'd be like "why won't you point out the things I did right?" He would tell me to "forget about girls, concentrate on finishing school first", which probably didn't help me with girls. At times I've had trouble opening up to him. And when he wants things done his way, he wants things done HIS way.

But as I've gotten older, I see more and more where he comes from. My grandfather (his dad) was a career Navy man, who was a disciplinarian, but also smoked and drank his way to an early death and gave my dad a couple half siblings (who we all treat as full family to this day). We have plenty of family that's had drug and gambling problems and a few that have gone to jail. He came across the ocean at 18 without knowing anyone and not being particularly educated and made his way.

And no doubt I caused a lot of trouble myself. Between me and my younger brother (who is a good kid just a totally different person), I feel my folks have always expected more of me, while also having a bigger fear that I'd be a complete fuck up. And at various times of my life, I've flunked more classes than I care to admit, gotten into fights, totaled a car, and actually been sort of a fuck up.

Probably the best thing about my folks, despite being overbearing at times, is that they've always been completely supportive when I've made a decision for myself. When I wanted to practice guitar more than I wanted to do math homework, they bought me an electric guitar. When I told them I was moving out, they were supportive and helped me out. Even when they don't totally agree, they want to help.

I don't know exactly when it moved from a fear and occasional misunderstanding of my pops to more of an appreciation and mutual respect. He retired a few years ago and he's been much more relaxed since then, which just happened to coincide with me starting to show I can support myself. It's sorta amusing to think we're related at times cause our personalities are so different, I actually have a friend from school who hung out with my dad when he was in the Philippines and she said, "You guys are so different... he's so hood!"

One of my favorite memories of him is back when I was learning to drive, he forced me to learn on a stick. Of course I dreaded this, cause I was terrified of just operating a moving vehicle anyway, and getting an underpowered Honda Civic to go while operating a clutch just amplified that. I remember one time he was with me, and I stalled the car out at a stoplight for a minute, and I was terrified cause some guy was stuck behind me. That car went around me and an old white guy yelled something to the effect of "learn how to drive!" and my dad stuck his head out the window and yelled "HEY FUCK YOU OLD MAN HE'S JUST A KID!!!!"

I was terrified back then but now I think back and that was hilarious and fucking awesome. I'm pretty sure my dad would literally fight a guy for me, and I love and respect him. He's a good person and he's there for me, and while I'm sure I'd do some things different, I hope one day if I'm a dad, I could be just as good as him.

[Aidan]

I think you hit on an important point; if you have children when you grow up, what would you do differently?

[Bounce]

(05-22-2012 09:10 PM)Salaam Wrote:  We are our own people first and then your son/daughter.

"Your children are not your children" ~ Khalil Gibran

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(02-05-2013 11:50 PM)Aidan Wrote:  I think you hit on an important point; if you have children when you grow up, what would you do differently?

http://postmasculine.com/what-i-would-teach-my-son